[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Murf the Surf

I thought Canada had strict firearms laws.

Right?!? That is an insanely arduous process.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Onesie

At least it works. There are no crimes involving guns in those places.

I see what you did there.

[Sedan_Clan]

NASCAR race car driver Bobby East was stabbed in the chest by a homeless man at a California gas station. He has succumbed to his wounds. Sad day!

[rwheels]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

NASCAR race car driver Bobby East was stabbed in the chest by a homeless man at a California gas station. He has succumbed to his wounds. Sad day!

There’s much more to the story. The “homeless” man was no angel. I did say was; he is no longer.

[vreihen16]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Right?!? That is an insanely arduous process.

Although this is probably more appropriate in the firearms thread, the NY State CCW permit process involves fingerprinting (that you pay for) as the first step. Then, you get to sit down with a sheriff's deputy, who types your permit application with two fingers and asks you all kinds of questions before printing it in duplicate. A nice deputy visits your place of residence about a week later, as a random verification of your home address as entered on the permit form. Once your state background and employer verification checks clear, they call the local police where you work and live to see if they have any files on you that would disqualify issuing.

Assuming that you make it that far, you now need to bring in four NOTARIZED reference forms and your duplicate applications (notarized) for a meeting with the sheriff's official that oversees the permit office approvals...from people who live in your home county, don't live with you or each other, are not relatives, and cannot be retired or current LEO in any capacity. Oh, and the safety course certificate, along with a purchase receipt for your initial weapon(s) that are sitting in the store's safe. Each of your four references is subject to a visit by a nice deputy to confirm what they wrote on those forms. You also need to provide a "to whom it may concern" letter to the judge, explaining why you want a permit. (I believe that this letter is main issue that SCOTUS ruled on.)

Get past this hurdle, and your application floats around the courthouse for months until the issuing judge looks at it and possibly calls you in for an interview of their own.

A few weeks after the judge meeting, you will receive a notice of approval. Off to the clerk's office, to be re-fingerprinted, photographed, and actually get your CCW permit card and see for the first time whether it's restricted or unrestricted. The permit also includes a release coupon for the store to let you have your long-paid-for weapon(s) from their safe.

Our county is pretty generous with approving permits, unlike the downstate and Long Island counties. Even so, they were throttling the application process back during the 2016 rush by only doing fingerprinting (first step in the process) two days per week and only offering 3-4 appointments per day. The wait to be fingerprinted alone was 6+ months, and you didn't have an option to have it done anywhere else.

Just to be clear, this is the STATE process. NYC has their own procedures and rules, and issues their own permits that aren't valid anywhere outside of the city boundaries.

If I am ever pulled over again in a traffic stop (not likely), I will hand over my NY State CCW card along with my license even if I'm not carrying. Every LEO knows that CCW holders are the most-vetted citizens in the state, and that it's *way* easier to file the paperwork to run for governor than it is to get a CCW here.....

[Buug959]

Originally Posted by vreihen16

Although this is probably more appropriate in the firearms thread, the NY State CCW permit process involves fingerprinting (that you pay for) as the first step. Then, you get to sit down with a sheriff's deputy, who types your permit application with two fingers and asks you all kinds of questions before printing it in duplicate. A nice deputy visits your place of residence about a week later, as a random verification of your home address as entered on the permit form. Once your state background and employer verification checks clear, they call the local police where you work and live to see if they have any files on you that would disqualify issuing.

Assuming that you make it that far, you now need to bring in four NOTARIZED reference forms and your duplicate applications (notarized) for a meeting with the sheriff's official that oversees the permit office approvals...from people who live in your home county, don't live with you or each other, are not relatives, and cannot be retired or current LEO in any capacity. Oh, and the safety course certificate, along with a purchase receipt for your initial weapon(s) that are sitting in the store's safe. Each of your four references is subject to a visit by a nice deputy to confirm what they wrote on those forms. You also need to provide a "to whom it may concern" letter to the judge, explaining why you want a permit. (I believe that this letter is main issue that SCOTUS ruled on.)

Get past this hurdle, and your application floats around the courthouse for months until the issuing judge looks at it and possibly calls you in for an interview of their own.

A few weeks after the judge meeting, you will receive a notice of approval. Off to the clerk's office, to be re-fingerprinted, photographed, and actually get your CCW permit card and see for the first time whether it's restricted or unrestricted. The permit also includes a release coupon for the store to let you have your long-paid-for weapon(s) from their safe.

Our county is pretty generous with approving permits, unlike the downstate and Long Island counties. Even so, they were throttling the application process back during the 2016 rush by only doing fingerprinting (first step in the process) two days per week and only offering 3-4 appointments per day. The wait to be fingerprinted alone was 6+ months, and you didn't have an option to have it done anywhere else.

Just to be clear, this is the STATE process. NYC has their own procedures and rules, and issues their own permits that aren't valid anywhere outside of the city boundaries.

If I am ever pulled over again in a traffic stop (not likely), I will hand over my NY State CCW card along with my license even if I'm not carrying. Every LEO knows that CCW holders are the most-vetted citizens in the state, and that it's *way* easier to file the paperwork to run for governor than it is to get a CCW here.....

Wow! Just wow. I have long guns but have never even entertained the thought of getting a handgun permit so I can't comment on what hoops a Canadian would have to jump through but I can't imagine it would be quite as involved as what you describe here.

[Sedan_Clan]

https://www.instagram.com/reel/CgAJx...d=YmMyMTA2M2Y=

It all happens quickly…..

[Watching The World Burn]

Originally Posted by Buug959

Wow! Just wow. I have long guns but have never even entertained the thought of getting a handgun permit so I can't comment on what hoops a Canadian would have to jump through but I can't imagine it would be quite as involved as what you describe here.

Speaking as a Canadian, I can assure you, it is more hoops. Much more.

Because CCW basically doesn't exist here, so to get it....much fricking more.

[Murf the Surf]

Originally Posted by Buug959

Wow! Just wow. I have long guns but have never even entertained the thought of getting a handgun permit so I can't comment on what hoops a Canadian would have to jump through but I can't imagine it would be quite as involved as what you describe here.

This graph is likely an over simplification of gun purchasing rules in the USA as every state is different, but it was created to illustrate to the anti-gun crowd in Canada what the process is to purchase and own firearms in Canada. There are very few CCW permits issued in Canada, I have only known of a handful and often they are a temporary permit for a specific purpose. One of the things that firearms owners in Canada are subjected to is having their name run through the police data base Canadian Police Information Centre (CPIC), every 24 hours to ensure they haven't had contact with police that would result in their licence being suspended/revoked.

[Buug959]

Originally Posted by Murf the Surf

This graph is likely an over simplification of gun purchasing rules in the USA as every state is different, but it was created to illustrate to the anti-gun crowd in Canada what the process is to purchase and own firearms in Canada. There are very few CCW permits issued in Canada, I have only known of a handful and often they are a temporary permit for a specific purpose. One of the things that firearms owners in Canada are subjected to is having their name run through the police data base Canadian Police Information Centre (CPIC), every 24 hours to ensure they haven't had contact with police that would result in their licence being suspended/revoked.

Thanks for that Murf the Surf . I still have no desire to own a handgun.

[Pablo Chacon]

Originally Posted by vreihen16

Although this is probably more appropriate in the firearms thread, the NY State CCW permit process involves fingerprinting (that you pay for) as the first step. Then, you get to sit down with a sheriff's deputy, who types your permit application with two fingers and asks you all kinds of questions before printing it in duplicate. A nice deputy visits your place of residence about a week later, as a random verification of your home address as entered on the permit form. Once your state background and employer verification checks clear, they call the local police where you work and live to see if they have any files on you that would disqualify issuing.

Assuming that you make it that far, you now need to bring in four NOTARIZED reference forms and your duplicate applications (notarized) for a meeting with the sheriff's official that oversees the permit office approvals...from people who live in your home county, don't live with you or each other, are not relatives, and cannot be retired or current LEO in any capacity. Oh, and the safety course certificate, along with a purchase receipt for your initial weapon(s) that are sitting in the store's safe. Each of your four references is subject to a visit by a nice deputy to confirm what they wrote on those forms. You also need to provide a "to whom it may concern" letter to the judge, explaining why you want a permit. (I believe that this letter is main issue that SCOTUS ruled on.)

Get past this hurdle, and your application floats around the courthouse for months until the issuing judge looks at it and possibly calls you in for an interview of their own.

A few weeks after the judge meeting, you will receive a notice of approval. Off to the clerk's office, to be re-fingerprinted, photographed, and actually get your CCW permit card and see for the first time whether it's restricted or unrestricted. The permit also includes a release coupon for the store to let you have your long-paid-for weapon(s) from their safe.

Our county is pretty generous with approving permits, unlike the downstate and Long Island counties. Even so, they were throttling the application process back during the 2016 rush by only doing fingerprinting (first step in the process) two days per week and only offering 3-4 appointments per day. The wait to be fingerprinted alone was 6+ months, and you didn't have an option to have it done anywhere else.

Just to be clear, this is the STATE process. NYC has their own procedures and rules, and issues their own permits that aren't valid anywhere outside of the city boundaries.

If I am ever pulled over again in a traffic stop (not likely), I will hand over my NY State CCW card along with my license even if I'm not carrying. Every LEO knows that CCW holders are the most-vetted citizens in the state, and that it's *way* easier to file the paperwork to run for governor than it is to get a CCW here.....

Getting my Top Secret clearance was much easier than that process.

It’s obvious their system is designed to discourage people from even trying.

[Murf the Surf]

Originally Posted by Buug959

Thanks for that Murf the Surf . I still have no desire to own a handgun.

My wife and I enjoy a day at the range but it's not for everyone.

[Buug959]

Originally Posted by Murf the Surf

My wife and I enjoy a day at the range but it's not for everyone.

Oh I enjoy getting out to the range with the guys and the rifles. One of the guys has a "range" at his farm. Its actually an old gravel pit where he built a big sand pile at one end. The longest shot is about 300yds which makes for some fun competition between us. One guy is a much better shot than the rest of us though so he doesn't throw in to the kitty. He's that guy that will lay a pop(soda) bottle on its side and shoot the bottom out of it through the neck at 100yds. I can hit the bottle but if I shoot through the neck I consider it a fluke. This same guy shoots skeet off the stern of his boat with a .30-.30 and hits about 70-80% of them. I'm not that good with a shotgun. He also has a 44magnum revolver that he brings sometimes. I've tried it but, like you said, it's not for everyone.

[floridaorange]

My uncle and cousins are like that ^^ experts with rifles and shotguns.

[Murf the Surf]

Originally Posted by Buug959

Oh I enjoy getting out to the range with the guys and the rifles. One of the guys has a "range" at his farm. Its actually an old gravel pit where he built a big sand pile at one end. The longest shot is about 300yds which makes for some fun competition between us. One guy is a much better shot than the rest of us though so he doesn't throw in to the kitty. He's that guy that will lay a pop(soda) bottle on its side and shoot the bottom out of it through the neck at 100yds. I can hit the bottle but if I shoot through the neck I consider it a fluke. This same guy shoots skeet off the stern of his boat with a .30-.30 and hits about 70-80% of them. I'm not that good with a shotgun. He also has a 44magnum revolver that he brings sometimes. I've tried it but, like you said, it's not for everyone.

44 mag might not be fun for a lot of handgun guys. I started my wife on a Ruger .22 and now she has a Smith & Wesson .357. But again, not everyone's cup of tea.

[vreihen16]

Originally Posted by Pablo Chacon

It’s obvious their system is designed to discourage people from even trying.

IIRC, the deputy doing the fingerprinting (first step in the process) here in 2016 said that 50% of the scheduled fingerprinting appointments never showed up, and over 75% of those who are actually fingerprinted never gathered up the other stuff and actually submit their completed applications.

Like I wrote earlier, I believe that the SCOTUS issue was only with the "to whom it may concern" letter to the judge, requiring you to explain why you want a pistol permit. That obviously runs afoul of the second amendment. I don't think that they actually challenged any of the screening stuff, but again I haven't read it and am not a lawyer.

Speaking of lawyers, there are attorneys who make a living just writing those "to whom it may concern" letters for permit applicants in certain less-rural counties, and also for filing appeals for those who are denied. There are no letter samples online that I know of, but I was a member of a state-focused forum where people offered advice for specific things to include and exclude. I wrote the letters for myself, my DW, and a friend based on these recommendations, and all three of us received unrestricted permits.....

[Buug959]

Originally Posted by vreihen16

IIRC, the deputy doing the fingerprinting (first step in the process) here in 2016 said that 50% of the scheduled fingerprinting appointments never showed up, and over 75% of those who are actually fingerprinted never gathered up the other stuff and actually submit their completed applications.

Like I wrote earlier, I believe that the SCOTUS issue was only with the "to whom it may concern" letter to the judge, requiring you to explain why you want a pistol permit. That obviously runs afoul of the second amendment. I don't think that they actually challenged any of the screening stuff, but again I haven't read it and am not a lawyer.

Speaking of lawyers, there are attorneys who make a living just writing those "to whom it may concern" letters for permit applicants in certain less-rural counties, and also for filing appeals for those who are denied. There are no letter samples online that I know of, but I was a member of a state-focused forum where people offered advice for specific things to include and exclude. I wrote the letters for myself, my DW, and a friend based on these recommendations, and all three of us received unrestricted permits.....

Maybe you should start up an online store and start selling your letter.

[vreihen16]

Originally Posted by Murf the Surf

44 mag might not be fun for a lot of handgun guys. I started my wife on a Ruger .22 and now she has a Smith & Wesson .357. But again, not everyone's cup of tea.

Nothing wrong with a Ruger .22 at the range. My DW and I went to the local indoor range once with a friend. He paid $100 for an hour of range time (minimum rental) and a few boxes of .40 ammo. Ten minutes later, he was sitting on the bench for the rest of his hour watching DW and I share a single $15 box of .22 LR bulk ammo and running out of rental time before the box was even half empty.....

[vreihen16]

Originally Posted by Buug959

Maybe you should start up an online store and start selling your letter.

I think that SCOTUS just ended that business opportunity!!! Plus, it took more than a few hours two write each one, since they were personalized for specific situations so that they didn't appear to be form letters when reviewed by the same judge.....

[Murf the Surf]

So not to make this political but this seems like the best place I can post this, two of my kids have served, one still in. Our government (Trudeau) has decided to make the Canadian Armed Forces more inclusive.....dye your hair any colour you want and grow it as long as you want....in fact you can wear a skirt if you care too.....end of rant. https://torontosun.com/opinion/colum...rm-is-shameful

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Murf the Surf

So not to make this political but this seems like the best place I can post this, two of my kids have served, one still in. Our government (Trudeau) has decided to make the Canadian Armed Forces more inclusive.....die your hair any colour you want and grow it as long as you want....in fact you can wear a skirt if you care too.....end of rant. https://torontosun.com/opinion/colum...rm-is-shameful

It's happening here too. Pronoun training, died hair, etc. The world is laughing at us.

[Pablo Chacon]

Originally Posted by Murf the Surf

So not to make this political but this seems like the best place I can post this, two of my kids have served, one still in. Our government (Trudeau) has decided to make the Canadian Armed Forces more inclusive.....die your hair any colour you want and grow it as long as you want....in fact you can wear a skirt if you care too.....end of rant. https://torontosun.com/opinion/colum...rm-is-shameful

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

It's happening here too. Pronoun training, died hair, etc. The world is laughing at us.

Sadly, Sedan is correct and it’s not limited to Canada.

I had the pleasure of serving side-by-side with Canadian Army while deployed and enjoyed my time serving with them. I’m so glad I retired last year and don’t have to deal with this, although it was happening prior to 2020/21 but it really ramped over the past year.