[EDWYER]

Originally Posted by hellrotm

Sound is part of the equation for many.

And a big part at that.

[damnitBobby]

Meh after having daily driven the f80 comp for a couple years I’d say it’s the car lacking soul lol

Not a mag racer so could care less which car has the better lap times on the n-ring lol. If I was after lap times I wouldn’t be driving a hopped up 3 series I’d probably be in a Porsche.

I’ll take the V8 please.

[MisterF80M3]

Originally Posted by Sublime00

My statement didn't include CS and CSL variants. Sure you can take Comps on the track but even those are more for street use.

This is by design from BMW and they're own thinking behind the M nomenclature.

IS500 is not competing with an M3 competition, a CS or CSL variant of an M car.

Sure there's some overlap with an M3 and M3 comp, but the IS is designed for spirited street use. That's one of the reasons this is not branded as an ISF.

Come through, I'll share some of my good shit.

You just said M cars "aren't built for the track." What are they built for then?

No CS or CSL variants. How about the M4 GTS? Which is significantly faster around the Ring than the M3 CS.

F90 competition ran a 7:35 around the ring. Which is even faster than a F80 CS or a 400k Lexus LFA.

[Sublime00]

Originally Posted by MisterF80M3

You just said M cars "aren't built for the track." What are they built for then?

No CS or CSL variants. How about the M4 GTS? Which is significantly faster around the Ring than the M3 CS.

F90 competition ran a 7:35 around the ring. Which is even faster than a F80 CS or a 400k Lexus LFA.

I thought you'd get the gist of what I'm saying. As you move up from the M car to Comp to CS to CSL and yes, GTS, the car starts getting skewed more and more towards the track use as opposed to the street.

I'm not saying an M car (not a CS, CSL or GTS) isn't capable on the track or can't be used on a track, I'm saying it's not designed for track use. Just like a track car isnt designed for you daily to work and back. Sure you can do it, but Is it optimized to do so, prob not. You can putter around town in your m4 GTS and fill it up with water for the injection system in a Costco parking lot, but that thing is prob not designed to be a grocery getter and when you scrape the front splitter over speed bumps you'll get the gentle reminder that this is much better on a track.

The IS500 is not designed to be a track car. That's my point. It competes with something between an m340i and an M3 and that's what it's designed to do.

Really don't get what the issue is here

[M3_WC]

Originally Posted by Sublime00

I thought you'd get the gist of what I'm saying. As you move up from the M car to Comp to CS to CSL and yes, GTS, the car starts getting skewed more and more towards the track use as opposed to the street.

I'm not saying an M car (not a CS, CSL or GTS) isn't capable on the track or can't be used on a track, I'm saying it's not designed for track use. Just like a track car isnt designed for you daily to work and back. Sure you can do it, but Is it optimized to do so, prob not. You can putter around town in your m4 GTS and fill it up with water for the injection system in a Costco parking lot, but that thing is prob not designed to be a grocery getter and when you scrape the front splitter over speed bumps you'll get the gentle reminder that this is much better on a track.

The IS500 is not designed to be a track car. That's my point. It competes with something between an m340i and an M3 and that's what it's designed to do.

Really don't get what the issue is here

No need to keep explaining yourself. Your points are very well articulated. I don’t see anything wrong with what you wrote.

[jmg]

Originally Posted by damnitBobby

Meh after having daily driven the f80 comp for a couple years I’d say it’s the car lacking soul lol

Not a mag racer so could care less which car has the better lap times on the n-ring lol. If I was after lap times I wouldn’t be driving a hopped up 3 series I’d probably be in a Porsche.

I’ll take the V8 please.

There is some truth to your statement. Daily driven an F80 and now track driven my second F80 and I've found driving on the street is lacking unless I drive like a "typical" bimmer driver-speeding and taking turns much faster than sanity allows for. This car begs to be opened up and it wasn't until I took it to the track that I realized what this car actually is. Highway pulls are fun, stoplight races are fine, and a poodle can think that fetching a stick at the park is fun, but wolves hunt for blood in the wild.

[bkfastwagon]

Originally Posted by Humdizzle

i agree it kind of feels like a cop out. "well our RCF can't compete with the M cars, so lets make it a 4 door and have it compete with the m-sport lineup"

The stock M340i is quite a bit faster than the RCF straight line, a bit faster on track too. Add in a tune (which you can't really do on an NA lexus) and the gap grows alot more in favor of the BMW.

so it come back around to the question: is the V8 sound, throttle response, and 'feel' of the car enough to make up for the performance deficit?

personally i hope it is. but they have their work cutout for them. if they can make the car feel like an E39 M5 in terms of the feel they might have a hit.

Lets be honest, even if Lexus made faster cars than BMW, a good number of people here would still choose BMW for the badge. Lets say Lexus makes IS F with V6 TT and just as fast as the new M3, would people here rush over to get it over the M3? Obviously, Lexus knows this and decided to go a different route. I like that it's not another 6 cylinder TT- we have enough of that already

[nioh_lbbm2]

i love where Lexus is at nowadays with their look and reliability. I just wish they'd update their interior to be on par with other luxury brands in the same segment.

[E92inNC]

Originally Posted by nioh_lbbm2

i love where Lexus is at nowadays with their look and reliability. I just wish they'd update their interior to be on par with other luxury brands in the same segment.

My sis had a 2015 IS350 and I thought the interior was a very nice place to be. Really the only things I thought were better in the bimmer is the steering wheel and the sport seats.

[jmg]

Originally Posted by nioh_lbbm2

i love where Lexus is at nowadays with their look and reliability. I just wish they'd update their interior to be on par with other luxury brands in the same segment.

When you just carry almost everything over from the previous already reliable almost decade old generation, reliability isn't going to change much.

[x622]

But I already had a 2012 Ultrasonic Blue Mica ISF with suspension, longtubes, an exhaust and some carbon lip stuff. Why would I want another when there are better options?

Why is lexus dead? Everything in their entire lineup sans the new shitty CUVs is literally decades old at this point. How old is the tacoma platform? The LX570? Why do you buy these things when the competition offers you so much more? Like I didn't have issues with my ISF, but I also didn't have issues with my German stuff either. Why wouldn't you just buy a 2010+ ISF? The navigation in these new ones is so shitty you might as well use the old stuff which works ok

[kyriian]

Originally Posted by x622

But I already had a 2012 Ultrasonic Blue Mica ISF with suspension, longtubes, an exhaust and some carbon lip stuff. Why would I want another when there are better options?

Why is lexus dead? Everything in their entire lineup sans the new shitty CUVs is literally decades old at this point. How old is the tacoma platform? The LX570? Why do you buy these things when the competition offers you so much more? Like I didn't have issues with my ISF, but I also didn't have issues with my German stuff either. Why wouldn't you just buy a 2010+ ISF? The navigation in these new ones is so shitty you might as well use the old stuff which works ok

We can speculate, but i'd imagine Lexus isn't reinventing their cars because they have a much bigger project coming, that's their Solid state platform. No doubt that's likely a big reason why they haven't been re-designing aging platforms, but just do enough to get by until Toyota's EV sweeps into the showrooms. Again, just an opinion.

LX and for that matter, the GX is old but it has a VERY loyal client base. Lexus for that matter has a massive loyal client base, those who wants a reasonably well equipped car that will start every single morning without any CEL or expensive maintenance and don't care for the badge.

You also gotta consider Lexus clientele isn't moved by flashy screens and all the tech. In that regard, Lexus knows its client, rather than dictate what the client want and introduce a bunch of stuff the client would have no desire for, they design for their clients, old and familiar. Yes it maybe outdated to many people, they know their client, its why they have such a loyal following.

Sides, Lexus is selling aging platforms just fine. RX outsells the X5, ES outselling the 5, yes 3 outsells the IS but the 3 also outsells everyone else.

[supra93]

The next gen Land Cruiser has been spotted and rumored to be unveiled pretty soon, so I'm pretty sure that means a new LX and GX is just round the corner. On a side note we're getting a new Tundra this year and a new Sequoia and 4Runner in 2022.

[Sublime00]

With the new M3 now out, I think this IS will sell pretty well (relative to sedan sales).

If you're in the market for a daily driver that's fast, and won't be on the track, instead of buying an M3 for $80k, why not the IS500 w/ $10-$20k saved?

If you're going manual then I understand buying the M3, but if you're going auto + DD, I'd opt for the Lexus + snow tires.

Thoughts from you auto M3 buyers?

[R N M]

^
I think the M3 will sell very well especially once the AWD version is out.

IS500 will be a nice option IF Lexus prices it aggressively. Typically the performance versions are overpriced and have horrible lease deals. Lexus also doesn’t offer you to do custom build like most enthusiasts prefer to get the exact color combo/options.

I personally hope IND or another company can make a normal grill alternative that will have more traditional styling.

[MisterF80M3]

Originally Posted by Sublime00

With the new M3 now out, I think this IS will sell pretty well (relative to sedan sales).

If you're in the market for a daily driver that's fast, and won't be on the track, instead of buying an M3 for $80k, why not the IS500 w/ $10-$20k saved?

If you're going manual then I understand buying the M3, but if you're going auto + DD, I'd opt for the Lexus + snow tires.

Thoughts from you auto M3 buyers?

I highly doubt there will be many M3 owners jumping ship for a Lexus. A lot of us started off with the Lexus platform. The main reason why a lot of us jumped ship is that we want a car that is more sport-oriented car, which Lexus lacked.

If I am in the market for a daily driver that is fast and I want the best bang for the buck. The IS500 would not be on the top of the list. A Charger Scatpack for 40k would be significantly cheaper than Lexus and a lot quicker.

[Housekeeping]

471hp, yet only 4.5 to 60? Hmmmm.

[Housekeeping]

Hate the stacked exhaust

[RM7]

Originally Posted by Sy1616

471hp, yet only 4.5 to 60? Hmmmm.

That's not hard to figure out. 395tq compared to bigger displacement V8s pushing more like 450tq. Then RWD vs. AWD with the engine up front and it probably doesn't have 315s in the back.

Yes most people base things solely on stopped 0-60 and stoplight-to-stoplight speed. This is probably not a car for those people.

[Burrcold]

Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes

That's not hard to figure out. 395tq compared to bigger displacement V8s pushing more like 450tq. Then RWD vs. AWD with the engine up front and it probably doesn't have 315s in the back.

Yes most people base thins solely on stopped 0-60 and stoplight-to-stoplight speed. This is probably not a car for those people.

Exactly. Also, I'll bet that those numbers are conservative. Lexus quoted the original ISF as a 4.6 or 4.7 second 0-60 but magazines and people on forums consistently got into the low 4's.

[damnitBobby]

I think it will sell just fine probably better than expectations if they keep starting price around $58k-60k. We are headed towards all electric vehicles this combo of compact luxury sedan + RWD + NA V8 will be classics in the future. Lexus reliability is just icing on the cake.

This is competing against the M340i, C43, S4 segment so I think it stacks up very well against them.

You couldn’t pay me to drive a charger lol

[The__J__Factor]

Devoed it's not coming together Australia, this is such a cool car.