[BMWCCA1]

The M2 CS is in too limited quantities in the US as people like me who were ready to buy, can't buy.

Hmm, I have no idea why that's a problem in your area. I have one 6MT 2021 in-stock and one on-order for a customer. I have yet to turn anyone away who was a serious buyer. Show me the money and I'll find a production spot.

Also a CS still in production that's listed as a 2020, for some reason.

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by chassis

- Panamera sales are down. It's a relatively new platform that people seem to like. What's up?

I think its the price. The Macan and Cayenne sell well because they are essentially gateway vehicles into the Porsche brand, and something loyal Porsche owners can get for their family, and the Taycan is new and cool, more unique with little competition, so that sells, at least for now. The Panamera on the other hand is much more expensive and doesn't lease well, and is one of the lesser athletic Porsche's available. They seem to just sit on lots, especially the Sport Turismo's, there are still a few new 2018's available, and many that have been turned into "demo cars." Its not just the Panamera though, but really the entire class, the GT4D and 8er suffer from similar issues.

[Meeni]

Originally Posted by jstein55

The Germans love to fill any niche they have. Even with the smaller sales numbers, the demand is there.

I do wonder if the X4/6 bring in more money for BMW since despite their sales numbers are smaller, they cost about $5k more than their more "traditional" counterparts on which they are based on, and likely have similar build costs.

And yet we can't get the 3-series touring. I'm sure they'd sell more than 6 series, or even more than X2s.

But you are correct the X4/X6 are cash cows. Any unit sold is pure money compared to an X3/X5.

[chassis]

Originally Posted by Meeni

And yet we can't get the 3-series touring. I'm sure they'd sell more than 6 series, or even more than X2s.

But you are correct the X4/X6 are cash cows. Any unit sold is pure money compared to an X3/X5.

I would love to see an M3 Touring and AMG C63 T offered in the US.

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by chassis

I would love to see an M3 Touring and AMG C63 T offered in the US.

Same, such a gorgeous and practical car and better than the GLC63. There's a member on the forums here who has a C63T, super jealous!

[smyles]

Originally Posted by jstein55

..Its not just the Panamera though, but really the entire class, the GT4D and 8er suffer from similar issues.

I think whenever someone walks in a Porsche dealership, they either go straight for that sport car (911/boxter) or SUV. They may spot a Panamera, even check it out, comment "yeah, cool car!"... and then proceed to that 911 or Macan. A 4-door sedan is just not what Porsche buyers are looking for.

[Germanauto]

My daily is an IS. I dread getting service done because their loaners cars are always RX or NX and make me feel dead from inside. Last week I waited 30 minutes for the one ES loaner they had (new model) and I was pleasantly surprised. For a FWD supposed grandpa car it looks nice and handled quite well. Seat comfort and NVH were top shelf. Somehow the steering was tighter than in most BMWs.

With that being said, it suffered from the typical Lexus awkward interior design, slightly cheap interior bits, and horrible infotainment system.

Lexus products are consistently behind competitors and for whatever reason their interiors always feel old relative to the German cars. But at the end of the day, they are priced quite below competitors and provide a worry free ownership experience.

[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by smyles

I think whenever someone walks in a Porsche dealership, they either go straight for that sport car (911/boxter) or SUV. They may spot a Panamera, even check it out, comment "yeah, cool car!"... and then proceed to that 911 or Macan. A 4-door sedan is just not what Porsche buyers are looking for.

I wish Porsche produced a smaller sedan at a more affordable price. Something mid-sized starting at say $65-70k I feel would be a big seller. The full sized luxury segment is mostly dead, but I still see plenty of mid-sizers around (5-series, E-class, etc.). The Macan has 4 doors but is a CUV, and the Boxster/Cayman sit low but are impractical. A mid-size sedan would be perfect for buyers needing a fun 4 door.

Unfortunately I don't think it will ever be a reality.

[Avaley]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

I wish Porsche produced a smaller sedan at a more affordable price. Something mid-sized starting at say $65-70k I feel would be a big seller. The full sized luxury segment is mostly dead, but I still see plenty of mid-sizers around (5-series, E-class, etc.). The Macan has 4 doors but is a CUV, and the Boxster/Cayman sit low but are impractical. A mid-size sedan would be perfect for buyers needing a fun 4 door.

Unfortunately I don't think it will ever be a reality.

I wish Porsche produced every car at a more affordable price and just kept their current lineup!

I'm sure Porsche could take an Audi A4 platform and spice it out but as Porsche enthusiasts that is just a bit plain meh. Better yet just drop the 911 starting price by 20k which we can keep praying for

These sales figures are rough and i don't think the new grille will help that much.

[SteveinArizona]

Originally Posted by Avaley

I wish Porsche produced every car at a more affordable price and just kept their current lineup!

I'm sure Porsche could take an Audi A4 platform and spice it out but as Porsche enthusiasts that is just a bit plain meh. Better yet just drop the 911 starting price by 20k which we can keep praying for

These sales figures are rough and i don't think the new grille will help that much.

I disagree. The new grills will help a lot...they will help Audi and Mercedes.

[The Choosey begger]

Originally Posted by SteveinArizona

I disagree. The new grills will help a lot...they will help Audi and Mercedes.

Huge grills are nothing new. The 3 Series used to be the most copied car, now they're copying Audi and Lexus. Pretty sad. The 4 Series also has the profile of an A5.

[bri1042]

I wonder how much of Lexus's ability to maintain sales was sitting inventory before the pandemic? In other words...bad sales before gave them more cars to sell without getting new inventory?

[Game]

Mercedes leads the YTD "by a wide margin". Not surprising, their new design cues are beautiful.

[chassis]

It will be interesting for MB when they launch the W223 S-Class. They need to do a better job with their flagship than they have done on the sloppy V167 GLE launch.

[Moflow]

Originally Posted by bri1042

I wonder how much of Lexus's ability to maintain sales was sitting inventory before the pandemic? In other words...bad sales before gave them more cars to sell without getting new inventory?

Yeah, i feel like there are probably a bunch of smaller factors contributing to their sales success right now. I also kind of wonder if a bunch of people are thinking "I have enough headaches in my life right now. I can forego the more fun BMW and go with the boring Lexus if it means one less trip to the dealer later down the line."

In other words, I'd bet European cars are thought of as slightly riskier to the average person and that people are generally feeling kind of risk averse right now.

[Keyser Soze]

Hang in there, plucky lil' Z4!

[stein_325i]

I was just at my BMW and MB dealer today looking around. Inventory is much better and the lots are actually filling up again. Q4 sales should hopefully improve for all brands.