[msk340i]

Originally Posted by yco

thank you for your kind words..
yes i ve watched it.. and it actually leads to reason why im not supporting Vettel.. i ll tell what after telling its reasons..

as in the video shows, in 4 corners there are 3 different problems.. even if the Ferrari package is performing the best with such a character like this, first corner exit, that oversteer comes with throttle control.. it can be soften without even changing the setup in the pits without losing time on track to compensate the time loss.. that exit is not that much an aero needy fast corner.. can be done by an earlier but longer throttle trail, opening the on throttle diff to let inside real wheel spin more free, or having a line that exit part is more straight.. and but more importantly did you realize he was touching the inside curb? faster drivers on quali didint even touch that curb.. cause it upsets the balance, and you re missing the oval part of the corner on apex and avoids carrying more speed into corner..

locking up the inside wheel.. if he didnt brake over physical limit that the car needs to stop, straighter braking line, more rear brake bias or closing the diff-coast diff setting.. i dont know if you ve seen Kimi in free practices, in the beginning he was locking both front wheels on braking points.. then he found the sweet spot and didnt do that again.. he adapted according to the given track conditions to minimize such problems.. more importantly.. did you realize Vettel was flicking the car with some steering wheel to the right before braking finishes and afterwards, front inside wheel locks up? it was maybe 2m early to start to corner.. i dont know.. but telemetry data between Leclerc and his knows..

3rd corner problem.. its obvious that car needs a wider line, maybe too much rear brake bias for the corner or needs more an open coast-diff there.. and 4th corner as well.. or just telling mechanics to changing the rear wing angle higher.. its not complicated and can be done under a minute.. sorry but its not excuse for a 4 time WDC.. maybe for a rookie driver needed assistance heavily..

so Vettel doesnt know these? he does.. he knows much more than these that i wrote in few minutes.. he knows how to setup a car, thats what is been talking in paddock over the years.. but the problem he is having after Red Bull days is, lacking the "adaptation" to the needs on track.. thats why we see such problems like when he is side to side with some other car, and he spins.. when the car is over the limit to overtake another car changing the line that it used to need, braking points, less grip on dirty side of the track many things.. thats why going off the track when it started to rain or going slower than others because of this.. adaptation involves a lot different things that varies on the situation.. top-notch drivers adapt to those moments "before" it happens and make it look like its simple..

i told this before but in Red Bull days, blown diffuser was requiring a technique that was artificial to nature of racing.. when you need more aero grip on the rear, you simply give some throttle.. on the limits normally you dont do that.. thats why its unnatural actually.. he adapted it cause, it was highly rewarding.. and he was the only guy going to the tire factory to collaborate with them closer before regs changed.. you dont see anything like this from the day 1 in Ferrari.. its like he left out of cards to put into play..

in my opinion.. top-notch drivers see what is needed before it even happen and adapt the car by its line, speed, braking power, throttle graph, gear, wind, steering wheel input, different grip levels on different parts of the track and million more things by instinct in very short time.. with a simple example.. you cant brake at the same point when you re side to side with someone when you re off the racing line.. cause there is less grip, tighter angle to the corner, maybe different surface angles and many more but top-notch drivers judge all of these in a flash and execute..

please next time watch Hamiltons onboard footage closer.. how he changes the brake bias like for in each corner for example.. take a look if Bottas was doing like that at the beginning of Merc' days or not.. Bottas learnt a lot from Hamilton only by judging braking performance.. remember how Schumi was adjusting the car many times during a lap.. i never been Schumi fan but he was top-notch driver and he was doing those things without compromising his concentration.. im supporting Hamilton not because he just winning.. he is winning because he works really hard on the car and details, on people he works with, he is very good on side by side action, he s not a rich dude as a character, he knows how to squeeze more from his car all the time, knows how to carry more speed into corners etc.. he adapts to the situations and circumstances in a flash.. remember the moments first time he wanted to taken out the rear tire blankets earlier than fronts? people were like wtf.. thats willing to go to unknown and finding solution to the car needs.. how simple its sounds right? or how he saves tires when its needed, or how fast he can go in the rain.. they re all adaptation.. and thats why he is winning..

anyway i guess it was a bit long write sorry but the thing i really dont like about Vettel and causing not to believe in him is the lack of adaptation in recent years.. Senna, Schumi, Hamilton and probably and showing all the signals Leclerc, Max, Norris, Albon are top-notch drivers.. they re driving with their head and heart combined in a flash.. not because they can counter steer fast they know it ll happen before it happens.. its a way different thing and it differentiates top-notch from a fast driver.. wish we could talk about the technical sides of F1 more here, comparing onboards more.. thats the whole hidden part and i love it.. but i have to fight for basic things sometimes here and its not that fun.. anything includes racing, im in.. cheers..

What you said is all true but the way I see it is that a driver of his calibre knows where to put the car and how much pedal pressure to put and where to brake but still the car is unpredictable. He said it himself on Saturday. He said Saturday's car felt different than Friday's even when they didn't change anything about the setup. Anyway, I'll never write him off. He's achieved so much. But of course Hamilton is a better driver. Leclerc is great but I'm not sure he's better than Vettel in his prime. And let's be honest, Leclerc would've finished 6th at best of it wasn't for retirement and safety cars.



Edit: I just watched the postrace interview with Vettel. He said he's happy he only spun once!!! He is not happy with the car 😂

[yco]

Originally Posted by M5theonlyone

We all have our favourites but it needs just one bad unsportsmanlike action from a driver to sink the race to zero.Hamiltons egregious hit on Albon has further lowered my opinion of him and I now consider him a stain on the sport that I love. He has one of the best cars on the scene yet from all his making he turned it all into a drama onto himself when a faster car wanted to get past.

then im sure you hated Schumacher to the bone.. cause Schumi was a top-notch driver but most of the time he wasnt even close to be fair on track.. did you hate him?

Originally Posted by msk340i

What you said is all true but the way I see it is that a driver of his calibre knows where to put the car and how much pedal pressure to put and where to brake but still the car is unpredictable. He said it himself on Saturday. He said Saturday's car felt different than Friday's even when they didn't change anything about the setup. Anyway, I'll never write him off. He's achieved so much. But of course Hamilton is a better driver. Leclerc is great but I'm not sure he's better than Vettel in his prime.

all the drivers are making mistakes.. and thats why there is a term, putting it all together.. and the reason they re generally shaking after quali.. and for Leclerc - Vettel we ll never know that answer.. each race weekend is another chance for Vettel to make things and they can go better so quickly.. i hope he does cause i dont fancy a 4 times WDC career d end in such a way.. this week, same track, same cars we ll do it all again..

[M5Rick]

[QUOTE=yco;26401477]then im sure you hated Schumacher to the bone.. cause Schumi was a top-notch driver but most of the time he wasnt even close to be fair on track.. did you hate him?



You conveniently bring in the hate card and compare with other incidents...that's why more effective rules have been brought in over the years since the '00's but apparently are still not stringent enough to stamp out this anomaly and doesn't quite go with the message on the front wings of all the cars don't you think?

[msk340i]

Originally Posted by yco

then im sure you hated Schumacher to the bone.. cause Schumi was a top-notch driver but most of the time he wasnt even close to be fair on track.. did you hate him?



all the drivers are making mistakes.. and thats why there is a term, putting it all together.. and the reason they re generally shaking after quali.. and for Leclerc - Vettel we ll never know that answer.. each race weekend is another chance for Vettel to make things and they can go better so quickly.. i hope he does cause i dont fancy a 4 times WDC career d end in such a way.. this week, same track, same cars we ll do it all again..

His performance was impressive up until he crashed. The gap to Leclerc was stable even though Leclerc was running in free air and he was battling a Force India (or whatever it's called) and defending against Ricciardo. But when you're attacking, on the dirt side, in the dirty air of 2 cars, in a car that's set up not to your liking, his mistake is justified.

[yco]

Originally Posted by M5theonlyone

You conveniently bring in the hate card and compare with other incidents...that's why more effective rules have been brought in over the years since the '00's but apparently are still not stringent enough to stamp out this anomaly and doesn't quite go with the message on the front wings of all the cars don't you think?

that was a hard phrase to digest my friend..
im not bringing the hate card.. since you said after Hamilton's action that for me there was no problem Albon had space but needed more.. i ve just asked if it was the same for Schumi days for you..

[rcracin]

Seems accurate

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by yco

that was a hard phrase to digest my friend..
im not bringing the hate card.. since you said after Hamilton's action that for me there was no problem Albon had space but needed more.. i ve just asked if it was the same for Schumi days for you..

Digest what you can, you asked did I hate Schumacher,so what are you saying you are comparing two different things that were 15 odd years ago.
My point was Hamilton could have easily let a faster car go instead of willingly bumping it off the track. So I will try and keep it simple, do you think Hamilton accidentally bumped Albon off the track

[rcracin]

It’s called elbows out. You werent crying like a baby when Max bumped Leclerc out of the way last year were you?

[yco]

Originally Posted by M5theonlyone

Digest what you can, you asked did I hate Schumacher,so what are you saying you are comparing two different things that were 15 odd years ago.
My point was Hamilton could have easily let a faster car go instead of willingly bumping it off the track. So I will try and keep it simple, do you think Hamilton accidentally bumped Albon off the track

only time Hamilton wasnt racing fair was with Rosberg.. and he had to tackle like that since Rosberg needed it.. im not in Hamilton's mind but taking the account his previous battles, and there was enough or almost enough room i dont think he did it deliberately.. you cant set an F1 car to bump someone out and being sure you wont have a damage.. its impossible its an open wheel series and its the very first race of the season.. i dont see any reason.. he was inside and actually they started to tangle after the mid corner already.. things dont look that clear in car like it does on TV.. Hamilton is not a now or never type reacting guy, he tackles in a smart way.. but one way or another he paid is fine and its over.. i feel bad that Albon lost his high potentially first podium or maybe a win..

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by yco

only time Hamilton wasnt racing fair was with Rosberg.. and he had to tackle like that since Rosberg needed it.. im not in Hamilton's mind but taking the account his previous battles, and there was enough or almost enough room i dont think he did it deliberately.. you cant set an F1 car to bump someone out and being sure you wont have a damage.. its impossible its an open wheel series and its the very first race of the season.. i dont see any reason.. he was inside and actually they started to tangle after the mid corner already.. things dont look that clear in car like it does on TV.. Hamilton is not a now or never type reacting guy, he tackles in a smart way.. but one way or another he paid is fine and its over.. i feel bad that Albon lost his high potentially first podium or maybe a win..

Fair comment my friend...reading from other sites you would not like what is being said of Hamilton.

[MKSixer]

You guys are pretty hard core today. I will lighten the mood.

[Ngilbe36]

Here is my take on the day.

Lets just start with the best part. Lando Norris. This kid pulled the fastest lap out of thin air to get on the podium. Yes there were circumstances that made it possible, but he did a beast job and I had chills when he crossed the line. So happy for this guy.

McLaren in general...WOW. I bet Sainz may be rethinking a move to Ferrari with the pace they showed in quali and the race. Happy for the whole team though. The emotion in that garage is amazing.

Ferrari...Ouch. Leclerc made more than the best of a bad situation and Vettel showed us again why he is being left out by Ferrari. I feel bad because of the way they treat him now, but if he really wanted to show them up, he'd have an amazing year, not divebomb into his replacement and spin out.

Merc
That car will be impossible to beat all year. They are a tier above, its not even close.

LH/AA
Its a shame that this incident happened again. Alex had a solid shot at a win but definitely 2nd. I think LH did not expect him to be that far along side him and have that much grip through the turn. Lewis seemed to take it on the chin in the interview though which is good. I dont think there was any malice in the action. It was an unfortunate event that lead to Alex loosing his spot (May not have finished anyway) and Lewis getting a fair penalty.

All and all...what a way to come back to F1. I just love watching them race again regardless of results.
Bonus! We get to do the same thing THIS WEEK!

Can McLaren get 2nd in the constructors this year? Its crazy that I am even considering it.

[tdott]

Originally Posted by rcracin

It’s called elbows out. You werent crying like a baby when Max bumped Leclerc out of the way last year were you?

Agree, some people need to check their bias.

[Maitre_Absolut]

Originally Posted by apexit4

He's pretty much a pay driver. Both seats at Williams have been open to the highest bidder for a while now. Latifi's father is actually even richer than the Stroll family and, interestingly, invested £200 million in McLaren back in 2018. So he got the seat because he offered the most cash for it.

Where did you get info that Latifi family is richer than Stroll? Stroll is multiple billionaire.

My karts at the track where Latifi started (Goodwood) they have paid to repave it recently, nice to see them give back.

[apexit4]

Originally Posted by Maitre_Absolut

Where did you get info that Latifi family is richer than Stroll? Stroll is multiple billionaire.

My karts at the track where Latifi started (Goodwood) they have paid to repave it recently, nice to see them give back.

I've heard multiple F1 accredited reporters quote that as well as other F1-centric sites. Both seem to have a net worth of about $2 billion.

The two main sponsors you see on the Williams, Sofina and Lavazza, are owned by Latifi's father. He's the CEO of Sofina foods, which recently acquired Lavazza coffee.

[243Racing]

Originally Posted by tdott

Agree, some people need to check their bias.

Hahahahahahahaha

[msk340i]

Man this thread is getting messy!

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

You guys are pretty hard core today. I will lighten the mood.

My friend that's a clear picture of Ferrari . Makes sense...
As for Leclerc : I don't see him as the Terminator but more like a young "Napoleon"
Ask SEB !

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by yco

then im sure you hated Schumacher to the bone.. cause Schumi was a top-notch driver but most of the time he wasnt even close to be fair on track.. did you hate him?

.

Schumacher ?
No hate here . Great driver skills especially in the rain ! Yeah mate it was unreal !
He found traction everywhere !

Back in time with Benetton and Briatore he was really shining ...
4 years later (some) heard he was driving with Traction-Control !
Traction-Control ? A what ? WTF is that ?!?!
The others teams would have killed ...To get it !

And with Ferrari it was pretty sure he was running with an outdated Jet-Mode (as we know today)

So our Schumi was actually cheating with secret hidden software ,at least half of his F1 career !

So yeah mate . Schumi was one of the best F1 drivers ever ...

[///M Power-Belgium]

The best of "Team Radio" ...

[msk340i]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

My friend that's a clear picture of Ferrari . Makes sense...
As for Leclerc : I don't see him as the Terminator but more like a young "Napoleon"
Ask SEB !

Seb has one more point than Verstappen 😂

[M5Rick]

[QUOTE=///M Power-Belgium;26404768]The best of "Team Radio" ...


Watching Christian talking after the race did you hear Max's car being re-started and revved,looks like they found and fixed the problem.