[954Stealth]

So the question is drivers Ed or teach yourself.

Answer: Drivers ed.

You can not possibly know all the ins and outs of the laws of the road. Let a teacher show your son the basics. Let a teacher show him how to drive safely.

But maybe have an incentive: if you go a year or two years without incident this is your reward: track day in the Z4.

Reasons:

1. Kid learns the fundamentals.
2. Kid is incentivized to be safe at a time when safety is paramount. (he's a beginner)
3. You get to look forward to a father / son day that you'll remember for a lifetime.

[Helltime]

I taught myself, and then my dad taught me how to drive a manual, I wanted my school license so I could drive to and from school when I turned 15, in order to do that law required driver's ed. First thing I asked my instructor "Have any manual cars, autos bore me..." He was surprised and said I was the first kid he had in his 10 or 12 years of teaching to ask that ha. The whole time he never had any real advice, and could not fault me on the test. Parents had me drive everywhere from the moment I got my permit at 14 in every type of weather condition, so I was miles ahead of my peers. Experience is key! The more experience the better!

[954Stealth]

That's true. I took drivers Ed but my Dad and I had some great times in his air-cooled Porsche. I drove that on ice. Aced my written because of the teacher and the driving test because of Pops.

[Litos]

Originally Posted by John 070

That's actually dangerous and on would have to be in such a small room for that to even work (200 sq. ft.?). A gas oven does not put out enough btus to heat a house.

I never said it was safe and i never said it heated the house...

it heated a kitchen, which was about 5x11...

it was the only warm place in the morning to change clothes...

our trailer growing up was only 60'x12'....1980 Fleetwood single wide trailer...

good ol days....

[Devant]

Originally Posted by 2011CrazE89

The day I’ve been dreading for 15 years is here. It’s time to put our 15 year old son behind the wheel of a car. I could probably wait another year. But why keep putting it off? Dropping him off and picking him up from school is getting old. The goal is to start him now and by his 16th birthday he’s on his own. His High School does offer drivers Ed classes and I believe I get some sort of insurance discount if he does.

Did you guys take Drivers Ed? Or did your parents say- Here take the wheel and figure it out? I'm a nervous wreck and I'm not looking forward to this.

I took DE because in the 90s you could get a junior license and 16 and a full license at 17, if you had the DE certificate.

I taught myself, started driving at 14 with nothing (learned to drive on my cuz car). NYC was a very different place in the early 90s. Miss it.

[954Stealth]

-- deleted --

[Hisam135i]

Most states require a completion of a drivers ed program if you're under 18, soo.........

[grimlock]

Originally Posted by 954Stealth

Imagine a blustery snow storm bracketing some icy evergreens and sweeping across the tips of 8" snow drifts. Imagine a frosty driveway covered in a sheet of ice. Imagine the raw sound of a 2.6L flat six rumbling the steering wheel around your cold, gloved hands - the leather and fur no protection from the 2 degree frigidity of the winter air. Imagine your father's voice coaching you about clutch/gas throttling over the sound of the Rolling Stones and gusts of wind bracketing the windows. Then too much throttle and a stall. "it's ok". Fire it up again. And then you do it! Imagine your Dad smile and the look of satisfaction of his face. You know how that looks, I can't tell you about that.

But what I can say is that in 10/20/30 years when you are looking back or when the kid remembering those are the moments you will both remember it fondly. Those moments in time, frozen by the winter and by time will be held dear by you and he.

His teachers will be fun and tell jokes, sure. But those brief moments with you and him - those times when you truly shared a great moment, something in common, a triumph. That's what will make it worth it. I tried to express that from personal experience, I'm not sure I did that.

Pass the tests with the teacher and get the plastic. But learn the journey with family and get the life-long memories.

I know that probably sounded stupid. I just want to somehow express how inane and inconsequential a process like getting a license might be. But it can be important and it can be something much more than just the process.

Let him take the class but please, please teach. Get in the car and share the learning process with him.

ok, now everyone laugh at me haha

sniff*

[954Stealth]

Originally Posted by grimlock

sniff*

LOL

( I took that out I was drunk when I wrote it - although I just realized its quoted ... oh well...)

[Nkc]

Gran turismo and gta should do the trick. He'll be driving better than you in less than 10 hours of game time. Get him to finish the entire game without crashing and he'll be ready for F1.

[BEM-S4]

Not sure if anyone mentioned it but if they take the AAA course and finish insurance will give you 10% off or something like that. Offer good student discount too. Depending on the kid they sometimes learn better from someone who's not mom or dad.

[upstatedoc]

meh..
I had friends that took drivers ed. I didn't take drivers ed. I didn't really see any difference.

[2011CrazE89]

Originally Posted by 954Stealth

LOL

( I took that out I was drunk when I wrote it - although I just realized its quoted ... oh well...)

Ha. That was actually well said!

[kevinbahnz]

The school I went to did not offer drivers ed but my son's school does and that what he did. After he completed drivers ed i would let him drive me around town. He's now eligible to take the road test for his DL but we're gonna wait until he gets a job because if I add him onto my policy it would be an additional 4 grand a year. So, whenever he does get his license I'm gonna give him one of my beaters so he can be on his own policy.

[2011CrazE89]

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

Not sure if anyone mentioned it but if they take the AAA course and finish insurance will give you 10% off or something like that. Offer good student discount too. Depending on the kid they sometimes learn better from someone who's not mom or dad.

I need every discount I can get. Once he's licensed my insurance rate doubles!

[954Stealth]

Originally Posted by 2011CrazE89

Ha. That was actually well said!

I learned in a Porsche on black ice. It was awesome

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by 2011CrazE89

I need every discount I can get. Once he's licensed my insurance rate doubles!

Call around a few places it depends on your driver / car ratio but assuming you have fewer vehicles than licensed drivers in your home he can be an occasional driver. I have an m235i and a Fiat 500 on my policy, long story but the Fiat is driven by a friend, and she pays $20 a month because we don't live together and she's just an occassional driver. So I have more cars than drivers but it's OK because we don't live together. Depending on how all that shakes out in your situation there are some ways to make it easier. Regardless until he's 25 he's high risk from an insurance perspective so you're screwed, whether it's a reasonably pleasant experience or a prison-style affair all depends on your particular situation.

[2011CrazE89]

Originally Posted by 954Stealth

I learned in a Porsche on black ice. It was awesome

I was actually afraid of driving and avoided it as much as I could. Till this day I owe my stepfather a huge thanks. At 17 I went to work with him to earn some money. After work he got so “wasted” that I had no choice but to drive us home. I drove from Manhattan to Queens NY at night with virtually no experience. It was the longest most nerve racking experience of my life. The next morning he tells me: How the hell can I get wasted on a couple glasses of water? I had to get you behind the wheel somehow! Been driving ever since

[Maestro]

As many said the best thing is go to a parking lot and spend as much time as you can there with no cars, if you can find without light pole that would be great. I did not do any Driving instructors with my kids, my wife and I did it ourselves and had no issues. My son failed the first time for one reason, he thought he knew best so the instructor failed him to prove his point. My daughter past the first time without an issue, and she did it in Feb, with piles of snow all over the place, pot holes galore, and it was foggy and raining at the time of the test.

We were told that testing instructors will fail you the first time if did not go to driving school, which obviously was not true. Both my kids had 100's of hours in the car and well over 3000 miles under their belts before they ever took the test. They also drove in all kinds of weather, day and night and on every kind of road. Ever time we want anywhere we made the kids drive us. For the last two years as my kids learned to drive the wife and I hardly drove anywhere. Now my kids fight to decide who gets to drive us someplace, it nice having them drive us around.

The last and most important rule we had, was this, If we told them to do something they were to do it immediately and not argue and discuss it before hand while driving. However we would tell them later what they were doing wrong or what was happening around them which required them to do something.

Also, I taught both my kids to drive a manual transmission while they were on a permit so they both can drive any car now.

One last point, most driving schools have everyday people working there, and they are the same people you probably scream about on the roads. I know my kids friends went to driving schools since the parents could not deal with teaching them. My kids will not drive with them, they tell me they are dangerous drivers, why because the do things to the letter of the law and guild lines, verse driving predicable so people know what you are about to do.

I give you a couple of examples, they will wait at stop signs until the road is almost clear, like 500 ft of no cars, when merging in traffic or changing lanes they will wait until they have plenty of room to move over. What happen is usually the person right behind them get tired of waiting for them so they go around them so they never get to merge or change lanes since cars keep going around them. Instructors tell these kids not to turn or change lanes unless there is plenty distance between them and any other cars. Yeah in the perfect world if everyone did the same thing.

They do not teach the new driver about the car, about how fast it can accelerate or how quickly it can stop. I spent an entire day in a park lot with my kids just accelerating and hard braking so they learn how the car responds especially automatics. The hardest things my kids learn was the automatic lag, from the time you press the accelerator until the car finally starts going. Same with braking distance. I spent time making my kids stop the cars before some point in the parking lot. The goal was to get at close without passing and they could only hit the brakes when I said brake.

[NickyC]

Parking lot, skip Drivers Ed. Also, learn on a stick. I've never owned an automatic transmission car in my life and never will. I picked up driving a stick in literally 5 minutes. Fish to water sort of thing.

I remember when I first learned to drive, it was on the Autobahn in Germany when I was 14 after tooling around in a Super Market parking lot for 5 minutes, no joke. My dad also let me drive quite a bit when I was 14-15 (License age is 16 in Missouri), including solo trips. Probably not quite intelligent looking back on it, but hey, I was never one of those kids riding my bike with a helmet on either.

[UncleWede]

I'm right behind, my son turns 15 in about 3 weeks.

I always thought Driver's Ed was a classroom, and there was a separate Driver's Training where you get behind the wheel.
I plan on getting him a "trained professional" and let him learn/wreck their car first. He will get plenty of driving time once he gets out.

I like that idea of offering to go the a BMW event if he can make it 12-18 months without crashing. His older brothers sure didn't.

I have to exclude him from our vehicles to keep insurance costs down. "Dump the kid, Harry"

[grieverr]

Originally Posted by Litos

imagine growing up and not having your own room until you were 14 years old...

To this day, I STILL haven't had my own room! From sharing a bedroom with my siblings, to roommates in college, to moving back home (where my brother was still living, too), and now with my wife!!

Ok, now that I think about it, I did have my own room for one year when I moved out of my parents' apartment and shared another apartment with a roommate. This was between coming back home from college and shacking up with the Mrs.


Anyway, OP, I agree that you should teach your son as well as have him take driver's ed. At the very least, you'd spend time with him and bond about cars. At most, you can help shape him to be a safe driver.