[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by CommitConfirm

Have you been single for long?

Married 14 ish years ... 6 years solo - rocked the single Dad thing and looking to keep it that way for another good run....

I may be single .. but it doesn't mean I'm alone

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by ryem3

E46 M3, had one, steel grey on red leather. Really looked nice. First generation SMG, drove like crap. Recall that this was a really overweight car compared to the E36 and I don't think had great reviews. Mushy suspension, I had coilovers on mine. If you think the S55 M4 exhaust note is bad, the E46 has that raspy, nasty exhaust sound. You need a "rasp terminator" pipe to get rid of it. Then it sounds pretty good. I would sooner recommend getting an E36 with the Vader seats than an E46.

Sorry @gimmeanM...

As an E30 M3 owner , this was exactly my opinion of the E46. Hate the exhaust sound that most E46 M3 owners love, especially if it was their first BMW. The car was heavy, understeered like hell, the SMG versions was only slightly better than the neck snapping E36 version.

I recall meeting friend at an autocross track and swapping for a run. I got out cursing the E46 for its numb handling, major understeer , soft pillowy ride ... then found I was two seconds faster than I had been in my E30. I hated driving it every second to a better lap time. lol.

I still never really liked the car but gained a little more respect.. and I hated that there was no E46 M3/4.. that would have been a car I could have really enjoyed.

Over the years since then , I've owned one ( by marriage ) and actually prefer the non M E46 cars as a daily driver. After being an M snob for decades, I've found that An E46 325 is just about bulletproof and a 330 Zhp is a sweet ride also.

The E46 M3 and the M2 definitely are similar vehicles in mission, and execution. Both are a bit larger, smoother, more refined and faster than the car they replaced in the E36 M3 and 1M respectively. Compared to each other, they are very nearly the same vehicle, it's no small surprise that e46 M3 owners that have owned their car for decades are thinking of moving up ... especially the ones that doubted BMW was " ever going to make a vehicle as worthy " and slept on the 1M

[PrematureApex]

Originally Posted by gtr

Correct, but the E46 steering is better than the E90. E90 I wasn't impress with the steering or recall anything that got my attention except the "V8" title.

I already have something "different" but was thinking about getting a E46 mainly for nostalgia and I do not own any traditional power steering cars anymore. The only new sports car with a hydraulic rack I can think of today is the AMG GT.

While offering more feel, the E46 M3 steering is LIGHT compared to the E90. Very light. It's actually a significant complaint with the car. The E90 steering might be preferred by some. Much heftier, while still offering a good bit of feel.

[GimmeanM]

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

Sorry @gimmeanM...

As an E30 M3 owner , this was exactly my opinion of the E46. Hate the exhaust sound that most E46 M3 owners love, especially if it was their first BMW. The car was heavy, understeered like hell, the SMG versions was only slightly better than the neck snapping E36 version.

I recall meeting friend at an autocross track and swapping for a run. I got out cursing the E46 for its numb handling, major understeer , soft pillowy ride ... then found I was two seconds faster than I had been in my E30. I hated driving it every second to a better lap time. lol.

I still never really liked the car but gained a little more respect.. and I hated that there was no E46 M3/4.. that would have been a car I could have really enjoyed.

Over the years since then , I've owned one ( by marriage ) and actually prefer the non M E46 cars as a daily driver. After being an M snob for decades, I've found that An E46 325 is just about bulletproof and a 330 Zhp is a sweet ride also.

The E46 M3 and the M2 definitely are similar vehicles in mission, and execution. Both are a bit larger, smoother, more refined and faster than the car they replaced in the E36 M3 and 1M respectively. Compared to each other, they are very nearly the same vehicle, it's no small surprise that e46 M3 owners that have owned their car for decades are thinking of moving up ... especially the ones that doubted BMW was " ever going to make a vehicle as worthy " and slept on the 1M

@M3adjuster My first car was an E36 M3, and while I still miss the car, I'm sure that most of what I feel is nostalgia. The E46 was my dream car and the E36 was what I could afford.

The things you remark on the E46 are true, but easily corrected...I've got delrin rear trailing arm bushings, KWV2 coilovers, dialed ride height and alignment and 245/265 tires (versus 225/255 OE). That with the manual transmission with a shorter 540i lever and Motorsport 3.91 rear end. The car is fun! I wanted it to be as fun as the 1M...I just don't think that's possible for what I love in the 1M. The S54 at full song is intoxicating however; and I actually enjoy the exhaust, it's unique, nothing else sounds like it.

The lines on the E46 are timeless. It's still a beautiful car!


The E36:

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by GimmeanM

@M3adjuster My first car was an E36 M3, and while I still miss the car, I'm sure that most of what I feel is nostalgia. The E46 was my dream car and the E36 was what I could afford.

The things you remark on the E46 are true, but easily corrected...I've got delrin rear trailing arm bushings, KWV2 coilovers, dialed ride height and alignment and 245/265 tires (versus 225/255 OE). That with the manual transmission with a shorter 540i lever and Motorsport 3.91 rear end. The car is fun! I wanted it to be as fun as the 1M...I just don't think that's possible for what I love in the 1M. The S54 at full song is intoxicating however; and I actually enjoy the exhaust, it's unique, nothing else sounds like it.

The lines on the E46 are timeless. It's still a beautiful car!


The E36:

Sweet E36.. and yes I agree .. you probably wouldn't perhaps want to go back that far.

Like you, I also prefer the E46 M3 appearance. Not as much as an E30 mind you

You are absolutely correct that (relatively )minor aftermarket adjustments can for a few $k make a major improvement in the handling of an E46.

This is true of pretty much most M cars. Usually minor suspension tweaks in addition to replacing the OEM shocks transform a BMW up another level - all the way up !

Offset control arm bushings for E30

Rear trailing arms bushings for E36 and E46

Camber plates and wider front tires for E46 M3, 1M and M2) are almost neccesories to really improve turn in.

The 1M's lively rear end needs wider REAR tires and perhaps a bit less spring rate to make a major difference in getting the power down.

Etc etc.

The biggest difference in daily driving a 1M/M2 vs the E46 M3 (and even the E9x) is torque. The amount of torque available at low rpm from the turbo motors makes daily driving a breeze , makes passing vehicles child's play, and one can accelerate in any gear nearly immediately , and just about effortlessly. Nearly all other normally aspirated BMWs have to be wrung out to get to the power (and oh what fun it is at full song as *any * M motor gets to the last 1-2k before redline )

This same difference with the motor does make the new turbo cars a little less satisfying on track. It's nice having a lot of torque off the corner but too much torque while in the corner is a lot harder to manage than being able to floor the accelerator in an E30/E36 and use every bit of power off the corner. ....

But as a daily driver.. oh man nothing like being drunk on the wine of torque !!

[Franzino]

Originally Posted by Nicname

I've also been browsing z4m's. Something about the styling call to me

Now that makes sense I have a Z4M roadster + M2 + 325i e46 wagon/touring... It's a great combination of cars with a lot of difference between them. I see zero reason why I would want two 4 seater coupe's (e46 M3 + M2) who somewhat both deliver the same driving experience; of course with the engine and steering being the biggest difference between the two cars. I like my cars to have enough difference between them....

[bimmer4life24]

Currently own a M235i (with a VW Jetta beater)...on a list for an M2...and have been ALWAYS thinking about a manual e46 m3.

[junx]

I know the SMG gets a lot of crap, but boy do I miss how much fun the paddles were. I had an 03 coupe and would strongly encourage anyone interested to get one ASAP and enjoy it!

[DivideBYZero]

Owned an e46 M3 for 6 years. Loved it, but wouldn't go back now.

[oldmanstyle]

Great cars, but not a very good car to compliment the M2 imo. It is a lot of work and and expense to bring them up to date on maintenance. The cars are a minimum of 10-15 years old, many have been welded on, etc.

[Franzino]

Originally Posted by oldmanstyle

Great cars, but not a very good car to compliment the M2 imo. It is a lot of work and and expense to bring them up to date on maintenance. The cars are a minimum of 10-15 years old, many have been welded on, etc.

My advice....you want an NA S54 engine, hydraulic steering and something that is completely different then your M2... Get a Z4M!

[Bimmed Out]

Originally Posted by gtr

Correct, but the E46 steering is better than the E90. E90 I wasn't impress with the steering or recall anything that got my attention except the "V8" title.

The "V8 title"? You make it sound like it was some kind of gimmick. How many awards did that engine win? I lost count. I owned both the E46 and E92 M3. Both were great but I really, *really* miss the E92. The power, the high revving, the styling, the sound, you name it. To me, that will always be the best generation of M3.

[DivideBYZero]

Originally Posted by kepler

The "V8 title"? You make it sound like it was some kind of gimmick. How many awards did that engine win? I lost count. I owned both the E46 and E92 M3. Both were great but I really, *really* miss the E92. The power, the high revving, the styling, the sound, you name it. To me, that will always be the best generation of M3.

Don't say that. I'm just about to chuck in my e92 for my M2.

[Obioban]

I'm a HUGE fan of the e46 M3, and don't think you'll have any regrets, OP! One of the best cars ever made, imo. In fact, I've gotten a bit stuck on them (recently went back to DDing one (albeit in wagon form) because I couldn't deal with having it as a weekend only experience).

Originally Posted by ryem3

E46 M3, had one, steel grey on red leather. Really looked nice. First generation SMG, drove like crap. Recall that this was a really overweight car compared to the E36 and I don't think had great reviews. Mushy suspension, I had coilovers on mine. If you think the S55 M4 exhaust note is bad, the E46 has that raspy, nasty exhaust sound. You need a "rasp terminator" pipe to get rid of it. Then it sounds pretty good. I would sooner recommend getting an E36 with the Vader seats than an E46.

Few corrections:
-e46 M3 had second gen SMG (that's why it was called SMGII). e36 had first gen SMG.
-e46 M3 rode significantly stiffer than the e36, stock vs stock (strange calling it mushy compared to the e46)
-Vaders may be the worst seats ever put in a car, from the perspective of comfort, support, and holding you in place. But, they do look cool. I retrofitted e46 sport seats in my e36 M3 street car and Sparco Evo 2s to my e36 M3 track car to get away from them as fast as possible! But, still happy with my e46 M3 street/track car stock seats, after I've used them for 144,XXX miles (still might swap them out because I want to get the car under 3000 lbs with full interior, and they're a big chunk).
-"really overweight car compared to the E36"-- context: In the USA, the e36 had the largest weight gain and smallest horsepower gain of any M3 over it's previous generation (e30 to e36). In the USA, the e46 M3 had the smallest weight gain vs the previous generation (until the F8X) and largest horsepower gain (until the F8X) over the previous generation. Soooo.... yeah-- seems like a strange criticism of the e46 compared to the e36.
e30M: 2998 lbs, 192 hp
e36M: 3219 lbs, 240 hp
e46M: 3415 lbs, 333 hp
e90M: 3649 lbs, 414 hp

e30 to e36: 221 lbs, 48 hp
e36 to e46: 196 lbs, 93 hp
e46 to e90: 234 lbs, 81 hp

Obviously there will be some variations based on optioning, but those were the curb weights and US spec horse power specs per BMW for manual coupes (automatics/smg/verts/sedans add weight-- keeping things as like to like as possible).

... the exhaust does sound pretty bad stock. But, I find most of your post to be blatantly incorrect! And, based on you thinking the e46 was cushier riding (dramatically isn't, stock vs stock), I suspect you were comparing a modded e36 to a stock e46.

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by Obioban

I'm a HUGE fan of the e46 M3, and don't think you'll have any regrets, OP! One of the best cars ever made, imo. In fact, I've gotten a bit stuck on them (recently went back to DDing one (albeit in wagon form) because I couldn't deal with having it as a weekend only experience).

Few corrections:
-e46 M3 had second gen SMG (that's why it was called SMGII). e36 had first gen SMG.
-e46 M3 rode significantly stiffer than the e36, stock vs stock (strange calling it mushy compared to the e46)
-Vaders may be the worst seats ever put in a car, from the perspective of comfort, support, and holding you in place. But, they do look cool. I retrofitted e46 sport seats in my e36 M3 street car and Sparco Evo 2s to my e36 M3 track car to get away from them as fast as possible! But, still happy with my e46 M3 street/track car stock seats, after I've used them for 144,XXX miles (still might swap them out because I want to get the car under 3000 lbs with full interior, and they're a big chunk).
-"really overweight car compared to the E36"-- context: In the USA, the e36 had the largest weight gain and smallest horsepower gain of any M3 over it's previous generation (e30 to e36). In the USA, the e46 M3 had the smallest weight gain vs the previous generation (until the F8X) and largest horsepower gain (until the F8X) over the previous generation. Soooo.... yeah-- seems like a strange criticism of the e46 compared to the e36.
e30M: 2998 lbs, 192 hp
e36M: 3219 lbs, 240 hp
e46M: 3415 lbs, 333 hp
e90M: 3649 lbs, 414 hp

e30 to e36: 221 lbs, 48 hp
e36 to e46: 196 lbs, 93 hp
e46 to e90: 234 lbs, 81 hp

Obviously there will be some variations based on optioning, but those were the curb weights and US spec horse power specs per BMW for manual coupes (automatics/smg/verts/sedans add weight-- keeping things as like to like as possible).

... the exhaust does sound pretty bad stock. But, I find most of your post to be blatantly incorrect! And, based on you thinking the e46 was cushier riding (dramatically isn't, stock vs stock), I suspect you were comparing a modded e36 to a stock e46.

That's a lot of lipstick. I don't know about you .. but when it comes to curb weight and chick weights .. I usually have a pretty solid figure in my head that I try not to exceed.

BMW must have started doing math like this around the E46... attempting to offset the weight with MOAR M POWAH

3415 lbs for an E46... that's the epitome of an overweight porker to any E30 or E36 owner. Sorry bro .. That's just real talk. Even if she is " light on her feet ".

Just like the M2. It needs a diet also. That's why an M2 CS is coming.

[Obioban]

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

That's a lot of lipstick. I don't know about you .. but when it comes to curb weight and chick weights .. I usually have a pretty solid figure in my head that I try not to exceed.

BMW must have started doing math like this around the E46... attempting to offset the weight with MOAR M POWAH

3415 lbs for an E46... that's the epitome of an overweight porker to any E30 or E36 owner. Sorry bro .. That's just real talk. Even if she is " light on her feet ".

Just like the M2. It needs a diet also. That's why an M2 CS is coming.

No offense taken-- mine weights 3148 last time I had it on the scales (with full interior and a quiet muffler). It just seems silly to me saying the e46 had "too much weight gain" compared to the e36, when the e36 had the second largest generation over generation weight gain, while the e46 had the smallest (and that's before factoring in that each pound more is a smaller percentage gain). If you're going to pick on a generation of M3 for weight gain, makes far more sense to go after the e36 or e9X.

Aiming to have my e46m under 3000 lbs before the end of 2017, with full interior (including back seats) and a quiet muffler

[chambolle]

I won't part with my October '94 production hellrot E36 M3. It's too good looking and too damned much fun to drive, esp. with recently dinanized suspension and a few other discreet mods. But for a long drive on I-5, my M2 is a faster, safer, far more comfortable ride. Plus I could turn the passenger seat heater on at 3 bars and cook dinner en route.

[cenz422]

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

I believe the correct saying is .. NO wife .. happy life..

That other saying im pretty sure was coined by a woman to make men feel like they aren't a *chump* for giving up what they like

If marriage is truly a compromise - no self respecting male should ever give over everything to the spouse ala happy wife - happy life.

AGREED!!!!!!

[Obioban]

Originally Posted by cenz422

AGREED!!!!!!

I'm strongly a believer that "happy wife, happy life" is only said by people with wives that are never happy except within 24 hours of their last large gift.

[Nine Lives]

Originally Posted by Denso

I own both and they are both great cars in there own rights
My e46 M3 is a fully restored Ruby red car and my M2 is currently being fully modded with a reveal in February 2017.


Denso

Seems to me that you've too many BM's on your hands.I'd be quite happy to relieve you of the 46 for a cash incentive as long as it's the manual version

[Denso]

Originally Posted by Nine Lives

Seems to me that you've too many BM's on your hands.I'd be quite happy to relieve you of the 46 for a cash incentive as long as it's the manual version

Haha sorry but can't part with Ruby who just so happens to be an SMG2, others may come and go but she is a keeper

Denso

[gds52]

Originally Posted by gtr

I do not know why since both the E46M3 and the F87 M2 are so similar but I'm in the mood to buy a E46 M3 beater.

The reasoning is perhaps all my cars are EPS and I miss the old school raw hydraulic steering feel.

I was almost sold on M2, but was waiting for more colors to come.
I understand your feeling for hydraulic steering....that's what pulled me from M2 to Z4M coupe.
If you are looking for second car I would say check out Z4M coupe or roadster.