[W///]

Originally Posted by stein_325i

I wouldn't say only "Tesla fanboys" like the tablet design as while they are the originator of the design, its clear that auto industry is following them, and there is a large market interested in that design.

Even with its controversial design MB has already had success with the W223 S-Class and its tablet style interior with 40k orders at launch (more than the beloved W222 at launch). Every automaker from Volvo to Subaru, Ford, Ram, Porsche, Audi, VW, and even BMW is following their lead and removing buttons and switchgear in favor of "touch-capacitive" buttons and large screens for "uncluttered" interiors. As much as we hate it, luxury is now more synonymous with screens and tech than it is leather, wood and metal.

I can accept that the industry is moving towards touchscreens only, although reluctantly. But to me, it's very clear that horizontal is far better than vertical tablets. Visually/design wise, I think vertical looks good, but in practical terms, horizontal should be the only option as it's much closer to your field of vision.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by W///

I can accept that the industry is moving towards touchscreens only, although reluctantly. But to me, it's very clear that horizontal is far better than vertical tablets. Visually/design wise, I think vertical looks good, but in practical terms, horizontal should be the only option as it's much closer to your field of vision.

I think there's a pretty good chance that everything will converge on a single touch surface that spans the entirety of the dashboard, or perhaps in some budget vehicles or dedicated high performance sports cars, just from the driver's side to through the center stack. This could happen as soon as end of decade. So one way or another it's probably all going to end up horizontal.

[supra93]

[supra93]

Goodbye C43, hello C45?

With good reason, the new C63 has been getting all the attention lately. It’s losing half of its cylinders while putting on some weight after adding electrification into the mix. But what about the C43? Well, German magazine Auto Bild claims to have some preliminary details about the "AMG Lite" version of the new C-Class.

Contrary to previous reports, the "warm" C might not transition to the "C53" name as originally believed, a change which would bring the lesser of the two C-Class AMGs in line with the bigger E53 / CLS 53 / GLE 53. Instead, it's supposedly going to be called "C45" and Auto Bild believes there won't be a C53 since the gap between the C45 and C63 would be too small to justify a third AMG derivative.

Much like its spicy C63 sibling, the C45 is expected to rely on the world’s most powerful mass-produced four-cylinder engine. Borrowed from the AMG A45 S, the turbocharged 2.0-liter “M139” develops an impressive 416 horsepower (310 kilowatts) and 369 pound-feet (500 Newton-meters) of torque in the hot hatchback.

The four-pot already has an extra 31 horsepower (23 kW) than the twin-turbo 3.0-liter V6 installed in the outgoing C43, but it’s down on torque by 15 lb-ft (20 Nm). With all C-Class versions getting mild-hybrid tech, the torque deficit will be erased after implementing the integrated starter generation (ISG). What the C45 won’t get will be the rear-mounted electric motor of the flagship C63, meaning the output will be well below the rumored 550 hp of the range-topper.

Another major change brought by the generation switch could be the death of the C43 Coupe and Convertible. Mercedes recently said it would remove some of its two-door models from the lineup, and logic tells us the Cs are the most vulnerable. We haven’t seen any spy shots with prototypes of the next C-Class Coupe and Convertible, so it looks like the two are on their way out.

The C45 in sedan and wagon flavors could be unveiled before the year’s end or early 2021, with the C63 in the same body styles to follow at a later date.

https://www.motor1.com/news/491828/2...g-c45-details/

[chassis]

The W206 looks good, inside and out, imo. Mercedes has done consistently well on aesthetics. It's subjective. I hope the estate or all-terrain come to the US market.

I hope their reliability improves.

It doesn't feel genuine to offer a car with the appearance, features and price of a modern Mercedes, with the reliability of a 1970s Pinto.

[stein_325i]

Despite countless rumors of the cancellation of both the C and E-Class line of two-doors, two (likely W206-based) cabriolet prototypes were spotted out in the wild. Some sources still speculate the new model will be rebranded the "CLE" and replace both the C and E 2-door models.

2023 Mercedes-Benz C-Class Cabrio Caught Cruising With Fake Tops In Spy Pictures

[stein_325i]

[chassis]

Overall pretty good, but a bit too much resemblance to the A- / CLA-Class.

[P1]

"Guys, come around and let's sit down and really think about putting an attractive and innovative dashboard interior together!"

"Naah, not feeling it today. Just slap a screen in the middle and let's call it a day."

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by P1

"Guys, come around and let's sit down and really think about putting an attractive and innovative dashboard interior together!"

"Naah, not feeling it today. Just slap a screen in the middle and let's call it a day."

And another one for the gauges. MB interiors are absolutely the worst. Chinese shitboxes have better designs. Peak awful is the new G63 with just two lazy Kindle Fires stuck side by side.
[IMG]https://cdn.carbuzz.com/gallery-imag...75-300x200.jpg[/IMG]

[heavyD^2]

Originally Posted by chassis

Overall pretty good, but a bit too much resemblance to the A- / CLA-Class.

I think that's by design to make the CLA look more appealing as an entry level luxury car. All current MB offerings essentially share similar front and rear end treatments. If you like the look you like the looks of all their offerings. If you don't like the look then you aren't going to like any of the brand's offerings. I don't mind the front end. It's not exciting but it's not offensive but I've never warmed to the sloping rear end profile. I'm not the target demographic though and I'm sure that demographic will be pretty happy with this.

[MJO316]

The C63 is an absolute abomination. I have a deposit on one to order. Just saw it go around the track in camo almost completely silent.

New M2 behind it was roaring.

4-Cylinder is ZERO excuse for lack of sound. Porsche's Cayman has plenty of sound. MB does not listen to its customers at all they're completely out of touch.

I read some statements on the car. They said they were developing this special system for exhaust sound in the cabin. What customer would prefer you to empty the budget on in cabin sound over outside sound?

If the car sounds good outside you don't need inside. They also made it a plug-in. The other hybrid c-classes are not. What AMG customer wants to plug their track car into a wall?

Just took the cars budget and went Willy nilly. I'm out a $1000 because I'm not buying this garbage lmao.

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by MJO316

I'm out a $1000 because I'm not buying this garbage lmao.

Never put down a non-refundable deposit on a car that isn't out yet.

[Burrcold]

Originally Posted by stein_325i

Never put down a non-refundable deposit on a car that isn't out yet.

This.

[Red Bread]

Still mad about the S2000 I had a deposit on for MSRP, only to get a call from the dealer when it arrived that it would be $10k over sticker and the dealership had changed ownership. Guess it worked out, bought an M Coupe instead.

[stein_325i]

The new Mercedes-AMG C 43 Sedan: more power, greater efficiency

Originally Posted by MBUSA Media

With technology derived directly from Formula 1™, the latest generation of the Mercedes-AMG C 43 Sedan sets new standards for innovative drive solutions. Following its global premiere in the Mercedes-AMG SL 43, the AMG M139l hand-built engine, the world's first series-production unit to feature an electric exhaust-gas turbocharger, is now also being used in the new AMG C 43 Sedan. Developed exclusively at Mercedes-AMG, the advanced unit is produced under the company’s "One Man, One Engine" principle. The new form of turbocharging guarantees a spontaneous response across the entire rev range and thus offers an even more dynamic driving experience. The turbocharger is operated via the 48-volt electrical system, which also feeds the belt-driven starter-generator (RSG). In the AMG C 43 Sedan the unit produces 402 hp and, in certain driving situations, is able to receive a brief additional boost of 13 hp from the electric motor. The standard rear-axle steering, AMG Performance 4MATIC permanent all-wheel drive with rear-biased torque distribution, AMG SPEEDSHIFT® MCT 9G transmission with wet start-off clutch and AMG RIDE CONTROL suspension with Adaptive Damping System also contribute to the dynamic powertrain. The 2023 AMG C 43 Sedan impressively leads its segment in both power and efficiency.

"The C-Class has always been an absolute success story for Mercedes-AMG. With the innovative technology of the electric exhaust-gas turbocharger, we are once again significantly increasing the attractiveness of this latest generation. The new turbocharging system and the 48-volt on-board electrical system not only contribute to the outstanding driving dynamics of the C 43, but also improve its efficiency. In this way, we are demonstrating the tremendous potential that lies in electrified combustion engines. The standard all-wheel drive, the active rear-axle steering and the quick-shifting transmission all serve to enhance the Driving Performance that is the hallmark of AMG," says Philipp Schiemer, Chairman of the Board of Management of Mercedes-AMG GmbH.

At the heart of the new AMG C 43 is the AMG 2.0-liter four-cylinder engine, which combines innovative technologies and high performance with exemplary efficiency. At the same time, it remains true to a tradition typical of the brand: not only was it developed entirely at the company's site in Affalterbach, but it is also manufactured there in accordance with the principle of "One Man, One Engine." In this process, Mercedes-AMG combines the craftsmanship of its highly qualified employees with the latest production methods of Industry 4.0 and a high degree of digitalization.

The internally named M139l engine (l for longitudinal installation) is the world's first series-production engine to be turbocharged with an electric exhaust-gas turbocharger. The innovative system is a direct derivative of the technology that the Mercedes-AMG Petronas F1 Team has been using so successfully in the premiere class of motorsport for many years. The new form of turbocharging guarantees a particularly spontaneous response across the entire rev range. This leads to an even more performance-oriented driving experience, while also increasing efficiency.

The functional principle of the electric exhaust-gas turbocharger in detail
An electric motor around 1.6 inches thin is integrated directly on the turbocharger shaft between the turbine wheel on the exhaust side and the compressor wheel on the intake side. Electronically controlled, this drives the shaft of the turbocharger directly and thus accelerates the compressor wheel, before the exhaust gas flow takes over the drive in a conventional manner.

This significantly improves the response directly from idle and across the entire rev range. The combustion engine reacts even more spontaneously to accelerator-pedal input, while the entire driving feel is significantly more responsive. In addition, the electrification of the turbocharger enables higher torque at low revs. This also increases agility and optimizes acceleration from a standstill. Even when the driver takes their foot off the accelerator or brakes, the technology is able to maintain boost pressure at all times to ensure a continuously direct response.

Powered by the 48-volt on-board electrical system, the electric exhaust-gas turbocharger operates at speeds of up to 175,000 rpm, which enables a very high air-flow rate. The turbocharger, electric motor and power electronics are connected to the combustion engine's cooling circuit to create an optimal temperature environment at all times.

The closed-deck design of the M139 - adopted from the world of motorsport - ensures maximum rigidity in conjunction with low weight and allows peak combustion pressures of up to 2,300 psi. The areas around the cylinders are mostly solid, and the cover plate is penetrated only by smaller ducts for the coolant and engine oil. Friction is reduced between the pistons and cylinders with a coated lining utilizing NANOSLIDE technology. This gives the linings a mirror-like surface which is twice as hard as conventional grey cast-iron liners, increasing durability. This coating made its debut in the AMG M156 V8 engine, and has been used to refine other AMG engines for many years. It can also be found in the Formula 1™ engine utilized by the Mercedes-AMG Petronas Formula 1 Team.

Another outstanding feature is the two-stage gasoline injection. In the first stage, particularly fast and precise piezo injectors deliver the fuel into the combustion chambers at pressures of up to 2,900 psi. The second stage adds intake manifold duct injection with solenoid valves, which is needed to achieve the engine's high power output.

The high output also necessitates a sophisticated cooling system that can cool the cylinder head and crankcase to different temperature levels. This measure makes it possible to maintain a cold cylinder head for maximum power with efficient ignition timing, along with a warm crankcase to reduce internal engine friction. The cylinder head is cooled by a mechanical high-performance water pump, and the crankcase is cooled by a second, electrically driven water pump. After a cold start, this pump remains passive until the engine has warmed up. In operation it is regulated by the engine control unit so that the crankcase is always cooled according to need.

402 hp and 369 lb-ft enable sporty driving performance
In the AMG M139l engine, innovative technology helps the Mercedes-AMG C 43 to achieve a rated output of 402 hp at 6,750 rpm. The maximum torque of 369 lb-ft is available at 5,000 rpm. Depending on the situation, the system also briefly provides an additional boost of 13 hp through the belt-driven starter generator (RSG). The second-generation RSG acts as a mild hybrid, providing this temporary power boost. It also supports gliding and recuperation functions for maximum efficiency. At the same time, the 48-volt technology increases comfort, as the transitions between the start-stop function and the gliding-mode function are almost imperceptible.

The AMG C 43 Sedan accelerates from a standstill to 60 mph in approximately 4.6 seconds. The top speed is electronically limited at 155 mph and by adding optional 19- or 20-inch wheels, it can be raised to 165 mph.

AMG SPEEDSHIFT MCT 9G transmission with wet start-off clutch and AMG Performance 4MATIC
Power is transmitted via the AMG SPEEDSHIFT MCT 9G transmission (MCT = Multi-Clutch Transmission), in which a wet start-off clutch replaces the torque converter. It reduces weight and, thanks to its lower inertia, optimizes response to accelerator pedal input, especially during spurts and load changes. The elaborately calibrated software ensures extremely short shift times as well as fast multiple downshifts as required. In addition, the intermediate throttle function in the "Sport" and "Sport+" driving modes delivers a particularly emotional gearshift experience. There is also a RACE START function, which ensures optimal acceleration from a standstill. The ECO start/stop function is automatically activated in the "Comfort" drive program; the "Glide" function can be activated in "Individual."

The AMG Performance 4MATIC permanent all-wheel drive features an AMG-specific torque distribution between the front and rear axles of 31 and 69 percent. The rear-biased configuration provides for enhanced handling, including higher lateral acceleration and improved traction when accelerating.

AMG DYNAMIC SELECT drive programs and AMG DYNAMICS control system
The five AMG DYNAMIC SELECT drive programs: "Slippery," "Comfort," "Sport," "Sport +" and "Individual" permit a wide range of vehicle characteristics, from comfortable to dynamic. The distinct driving modes offer an individual driving experience, precisely tailored to different driving conditions. In the "Sport" and "Sport+" programs, the engine's responsiveness, the transmission's shifting behavior, and the suspension and steering are tuned to be particularly agile.

The AMG C 43 also features the integrated "AMG DYNAMICS" driving dynamics control system as a component of the AMG DYNAMIC SELECT drive programs. This enhances the stabilizing functions of the Electronic Stability Program ESP® with interventions to add agility to the steering characteristics and additional ESP® functions. When cornering at speed, for example, brief braking intervention at the inner rear wheel generates a defined yawing moment around the vertical axis for responsive and precise turn-in.

The extent and effectiveness of these interventions depend on the AMG DYNAMIC SELECT program selected, whereby drivers using "Individual" mode can determine the settings for the AMG DYNAMICS levels "Basic," "Advanced" and "Pro" for themselves. The ESP® can be adjusted in three stages. "On" is the standard selection that offers high safety, adapted to the sporty character of the overall vehicle. "Sport," on the other hand, allows higher drift angles, while "Off" allows the system to be switched off completely for a particularly sporty driving style on closed-course race tracks.

AMG RIDE CONTROL suspension with Adaptive Damping System
The AMG RIDE CONTROL steel-spring suspension with Adaptive Damping System, which is standard on the AMG C 43, combines decidedly sporty driving dynamics with the long-distance driving comfort. The basis for this is provided by the front axle, with specially developed steering knuckles and suspension joints on the spring control arm, and by the rear axle, which also features elastokinematics designed for driving dynamics. Complementing this, the Adaptive Damping System continuously adapts the damping at each individual wheel to the current demand - always taking into account the preselected suspension level, the driving style and the condition of the road surface. In addition to an improvement in ride quality and comfort, this leads, above all, to an increase in driving safety. There is a choice of three different damping maps ("Comfort," "Sport" and "Sport+").

Three-stage AMG parameter steering and standard rear-axle steering
The steering layout of the AMG C 43 contributes to the improvement in both dynamics and comfort. The three-stage AMG parameter steering system, for example, features a variable steering geometry ratio that adapts to the selected drive program. At high speeds, the steering power assistance decreases; at low speeds it is steadily increased. As a result, comparatively little steering effort is required at low speeds, or when maneuvering and parking, while the best possible control over the vehicle is maintained when driving faster. In the "Sport" and "Sport+" suspension settings, the driver also experiences significantly more feedback about the driving condition via the steering wheel.

The new AMG C 43 brings rear-axle steering to the best-selling model series from Affalterbach as standard. It operates with a maximum steering angle of 2.5°. Up to this point, the rear wheels turn in the opposite direction to the front wheels at speeds of up to 37 mph (variable depending on the AMG DYNAMICS setting). This leads to a virtual shortening of the wheelbase, which in turn results in significantly more agile turn-in, less steering effort and improved maneuverability. For example, the turning circle is noticeably reduced when turning or parking. At speeds above 37 mph (variable depending on the AMG DYNAMICS setting), the rear wheels turn in parallel to the front wheels - up to a maximum of 0.7°. This virtual extension of the wheelbase has a positive effect on driving stability, leads to a faster build-up of lateral force when changing direction and thus to a more direct reaction of the vehicle to steering commands. The response of the rear-axle steering depends on the selected AMG DYNAMIC SELECT drive program.

AMG sport braking system and AMG exhaust system
The AMG sport braking system with silver-painted brake calipers and black "AMG" lettering guarantees outstanding deceleration values and optimum control. On the AMG C 43, internally ventilated and perforated brake discs measuring 370 x 36 millimeters with 4-piston fixed calipers are fitted at the front axle, and discs measuring 320 x 24 millimeters with 1-piston floating calipers at the rear.

The AMG exhaust system with its sporty engine sound provides the appropriate acoustic background. Depending on the drive program selected, the noise level ranges from balanced and discreet to sporty. The sound characteristics are controlled via an exhaust-gas flap, depending on engine speed and load. For the occupants, the listening pleasure can be further enhanced by the addition of the optional AMG Real Performance Sound. The actual engine sound is picked up by a sensor in the exhaust system and fed into the interior for a particularly emotive sound experience.

Characteristic AMG elements for the exterior and interior ensure a sporty, refined appearance
On the exterior, numerous AMG-specific details underscore both the dynamic and the luxurious character of the AMG C 43. In terms of exterior design, these include the AMG-specific radiator grille with vertical struts in chrome, AMG front bumper with air flics, sporty air intakes and chrome-plated trim element, matching side sill panels, the diffuser-look rear bumper, and two round twin-tailpipe trim elements. The AMG C 43 is fitted with AMG light-alloy wheels and 18-inch tires as standard, with 19- and 20-inch options available.

In the interior, features such as AMG seats with a distinct upholstery layout and seat covers in black MB-Tex/Microfiber with red contrasting stitching and red seat belts provide a particularly sporty touch. The flat-bottom AMG Performance steering wheel in Nappa leather has a perforated grip area and silver-colored aluminum gearshift paddles. The two round AMG steering wheel buttons allow fast and unerring operation of various dynamic driving functions and AMG DYNAMIC SELECT drive programs. The dashboard and upper door trim are upholstered in leather with red topstitching. The sporty, luxurious atmosphere is rounded off by AMG sport pedals, AMG floor mats and illuminated door sills with AMG lettering.

The MBUX infotainment system features various AMG-specific displays and functions. These include special displays in the 12.3-inch digital instrument cluster, 11.9-inch LCD center touchscreen and optional Head-Up

Display. AMG TRACK PACE, the optional data logger for use on the race track, is also integrated. This software records more than 80 vehicle-specific data points such as speed, acceleration, steering angle and brake pedal actuation ten times per second while the car is driven on track. In addition, there is a display of lap and sector times as well as additional training and analysis tools.

[syd34]

[stein_325i]

C/D - 2022 Mercedes-Benz C-Class Is One for Traditionalists
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[TheBingoBalls]

Hopefully the dash isn't all fantastic plastic like the W205. The most embarrassing, laughable, inexcusable QC I have experienced for this type of car. Every part you touch would creek and forget about driving on imperfect roads, constant creaking from the dash going over bumps.

Mercedes may have aesthetically pleasing designs, but the overall quality leaves a lot to be desired - this goes for all their models.

[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

Hopefully the dash isn't all fantastic plastic like the W205. The most embarrassing, laughable, inexcusable QC I have experienced for this type of car. Every part you touch would creek and forget about driving on imperfect roads, constant creaking from the dash going over bumps.

Mercedes may have aesthetically pleasing designs, but the overall quality leaves a lot to be desired - this goes for all their models.

I've known multiple people with W205s and they all have quality/reliability issues, it's almost comical how every single one of these examples I've seen are problematic. From C300 to a C63s lemon and everything in between.

Just last week I was in my friend's C43 coupe and the B and C pillar were rattling. The retractable seatbelt mechanism squeezes every time.

Such poorly built cars.

[Germanauto]

Overall this is pretty attractive, will be nice to finally see them at dealers. TBH Mercedes could have a real hit on their hands if they launched an EV version as well, it would attract back a lot of Tesla Model 3 people.

Instead in 2-3 years they will probably launch some ugly a$$ EQC.

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

I've known multiple people with W205s and they all have quality/reliability issues, it's almost comical how every single one of these examples I've seen are problematic. From C300 to a C63s lemon and everything in between.

Just last week I was in my friend's C43 coupe and the B and C pillar were rattling. The retractable seatbelt mechanism squeezes every time.

Such poorly built cars.

The W205 has to be one of the most disappointing Mercedes releases I have experienced.

I remember when they had the concept/production model at the auto show, it was on a spinning platform and you couldn't sit in it and this was before any press drives were available. I thought to myself, if this was the final design and if Mercedes actually put effort into making this a bit more fun to drive, it could completely dethrone the 3 Series. In reality it was complete disappointment. Quality was terrible, the drive wasn't as luxurious as you would expect a Mercedes to feel like even in this class but also didn't feel sporty like a 3 Series. Infotainment was absolute rubbish. Overall, it was pleasing to the eye but the experience was terrible.

Everyone can complain about BMW's being too conservative with their interiors but their quality is never an issue. I still can't believe that something as expensive as a GLE/GLS has that dummy vent on the dash.