[heavyD^2]

Dude you are the one that said it bombed. It's up to you to prove it as there's little evidence out there that supports your argument as sales have been solid for a car of this type.

[RugbyBro]

[VisualEcho]

Originally Posted by heavyD^2

Dude you are the one that said it bombed.

It did bomb (I don't think I've ever seen press that bad), and they had the opportunity to do at least one thing right, you know, like make it light, make it available in 6MT, make it a real Toyota product, make it beautiful, fuck, just make it something enthusiasts really wanted.

But alas, it was the ultimate ball drop...not mic drop, because they did none of those things.

It needed to be this, and it just wasn't.

[strohw]

I forgot about those. Toyota took what would have easily been a $125k sports car and through partnership produced something pretty close to that non-functional render for 50k. I'm pretty impressed and have to give them props.

But of course, you know, there isn't a manual and the car doesn't look like a render so it's definitely not what enthusiasts wanted. The car wasn't even made by Toyota so I have no idea WTF those 6000 people who bought a Supra last year where thinking. I bet they are super concerned about all the people who join Supra threads and bash the car because in their mind Toyota really messed up not building a $100K plus car....that they weren't going to buy anyway.

[VisualEcho]

Originally Posted by strohw

But of course, you know, there isn't a manual and the car doesn't look like a render so it's definitely not what enthusiasts wanted. The car wasn't even made by Toyota so I have no idea WTF those 6000 people who bought a Supra last year where thinking.

Pretty much.

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by strohw

so I have no idea WTF those 6000 people who bought a Supra last year where thinking.

Not to mention those who bought with markups only for the next model year to bring more power.

[strohw]

Originally Posted by stein_325i

Not to mention those who bought with markups only for the next model year to bring more power.

You could look at it from glass half full stand point in that all 2020 can be flashed tuned. 1 more month and we're on 1 year since the lock down by Bosch and still no cracks.

[Red Bread]

The FT1 is such a bloated turd and at $125k would have sold seven or eight models. Thank god they didn't do that stupid move. And what's this about Toyota making cars that people lust after? They've never done that, unless the Prius counts.

The current one is selling well, you know, what car companies are supposed to do.

[heavyD^2]

Originally Posted by VisualEcho

It did bomb (I don't think I've ever seen press that bad), and they had the opportunity to do at least one thing right, you know, like make it light, make it available in 6MT, make it a real Toyota product, make it beautiful, fuck, just make it something enthusiasts really wanted.

But alas, it was the ultimate ball drop...not mic drop, because they did none of those things.

It needed to be this, and it just wasn't.

The issue is that you are projecting your opinion as fact. The sales don't back up your argument and really the press hasn't nearly been as bad as you are making it out to be as it's made the Car & Driver 10 Best list back to back years and there are many positive reviews out there. Yes some hate that it's made by BMW and it probably should have had a manual transmission option (that may still come) but it's pretty good value per dollar as far as performance goes and it's an attention magnet on the streets. So while it's not perfect, it's far from a bomb and so far a pretty successful venture given the sales to date.

[kyriian]

Originally Posted by VisualEcho

It did bomb (I don't think I've ever seen press that bad), and they had the opportunity to do at least one thing right, you know, like make it light, make it available in 6MT, make it a real Toyota product, make it beautiful, fuck, just make it something enthusiasts really wanted.

But alas, it was the ultimate ball drop...not mic drop, because they did none of those things.

I am going to take sales figures as the metric for whether a car did well, and taking all stats from the same site, from the same country, as sales figures vary between sources

In 2020, Porsche shifted 3447 718s
https://www.goodcarbadcar.net/porsch...sales-figures/
it does not split between Cayman and Boxster, and available in a manual as well

In 2020, Toyota shifted 5887 Zupras
https://www.goodcarbadcar.net/toyota...sales-figures/

In 2020, BMW shifted 2364 Z4s
https://www.goodcarbadcar.net/bmw-z4-sales-figures/

In total partnership, combining the Supra/Z4 numbers as equivalent to Porsche 718 Cayman/Boxster, BMW/Toyota partnership seems to have completed killed Porsche. I guess if we are comparing it to a Rav4 (they sell 73 Rav4s for every Supra in the US in 2020), then yes the Supra totally bombed

[VisualEcho]

Originally Posted by heavyD^2

The issue is that you are projecting your opinion as fact.

I don't see that at all. I'm merely stating the facts; it would have sold more had it been a true Toyota product, had it been more beautiful, and had it come with a 6MT option (as all cars this size and type should).

Originally Posted by kyriian

I am going to take sales figures as the metric for whether a car did well..

That's fair. I take more of a historical/future view. I love BMW, and I love Toyota, but I'd walk before I put money into a BMW that's been re-badged/tweaked and called a Toyota...especially when it's their halo car. And if you look, you'll see that I'm not alone. The last gen Supra was special. This car is, well, un-special at best. And in the future what's it going to be worth? Nothing. An abomination that will never be lauded for anything.