[jkline398]

On a serious note to this, you have up to a couple miles to pull over for officer. You are not wasting their time and if you were speeding or know obviously what you did wrong, just drive 5 under speed limit with your flashers on to the next exit. I haven't pulled over on a shoulder in over 15 years doing this in everything from a motorcycle once to big rig trucks driven for work, the cop will always prefer you make them drive a little while with their lights on vs stopped on a curve or hill and making them hide in the passenger window, they may even thank you for it and let you off easy 😉

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by jkline398

On a serious note to this, you have up to a couple miles to pull over for officer. You are not wasting their time and if you were speeding or know obviously what you did wrong, just drive 5 under speed limit with your flashers on to the next exit. I haven't pulled over on a shoulder in over 15 years doing this in everything from a motorcycle once to big rig trucks driven for work, the cop will always prefer you make them drive a little while with their lights on vs stopped on a curve or hill and making them hide in the passenger window, they may even thank you for it and let you off easy ��

Haha yeah about that... I would not say all cops are like that. Most times police egos are so big they will berate you about doing that. I saw so many videos on my feed about police being mad at the driver doing that and threatening to charge him with fleeing/evading or even one where the police office literally pits the car while it's driving with the hazards slowly! Furthermore they become suspicious and think you are hiding something.

[KevinGS]

Originally Posted by TheMidnightNarwhal

Haha yeah about that... I would not say all cops are like that. Most times police egos are so big they will berate you about doing that. I saw so many videos on my feed about police being mad at the driver doing that and threatening to charge him with fleeing/evading or even one where the police office literally pits the car while it's driving with the hazards slowly! Furthermore they become suspicious and think you are hiding something.

Exactly

I would be VERY careful with this advice. This could have an office exit his car and approach you with an itchy trigger finger, especially at night.

"He didn't obey my orders, he just kept driving, so..."

[jkoral]

Originally Posted by jkline398

On a serious note to this, you have up to a couple miles to pull over for officer. You are not wasting their time and if you were speeding or know obviously what you did wrong, just drive 5 under speed limit with your flashers on to the next exit. I haven't pulled over on a shoulder in over 15 years doing this in everything from a motorcycle once to big rig trucks driven for work, the cop will always prefer you make them drive a little while with their lights on vs stopped on a curve or hill and making them hide in the passenger window, they may even thank you for it and let you off easy 😉

Except in Little Rock, Arkansas:
https://www.news10.com/news/national...ver-flips-car/

Pregnant woman clocked 84 in 70, "slowed down, moved to the right lane, and turned on her hazard lights". Highway left driver with “no room to safely pull over” because the shoulder was too small with concrete barriers on the side.

3 minutes later, Police perform PIT maneuver:

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by jkoral

Except in Little Rock, Arkansas:
https://www.news10.com/news/national...ver-flips-car/

Pregnant woman clocked 84 in 70, "slowed down, moved to the right lane, and turned on her hazard lights". Highway left driver with “no room to safely pull over” because the shoulder was too small with concrete barriers on the side.

3 minutes later, Police perform PIT maneuver:

Yep that was the video I saw! It's crazy the kind of shit police can do to you and get away with it. Zero accountability for the officer involved. Yet they are ready to throw the book at regular civilians. Absolute bull.

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by KevinGS

Exactly

I would be VERY careful with this advice. This could have an office exit his car and approach you with an itchy trigger finger, especially at night.

"He didn't obey my orders, he just kept driving, so..."

Yeah man just the other day a cop just started firing at me. happens all the time. Last night I was driving down the highway and I saw a cop walk right up and just started blasting this guy he pulled over.



There is just no way we’re going to turn this ship around. Not a chance.

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by TheMidnightNarwhal

Yep that was the video I saw! It's crazy the kind of shit police can do to you and get away with it. Zero accountability for the officer involved. Yet they are ready to throw the book at regular civilians. Absolute bull.

Why would the officer be held accountable for what was at the time a perfectly legal and required move? Was it a stupid policy? Of course it was and you see the result of it in this case. How is that the officers fault? This accident caused the rules and policy to be changed and I’m sure that lady got quite a bit of money from that department and rightfully so. This was a tragedy caused by a stupid authorized Police Department policy that has now been changed. See the article I posted.

I’m thinking now maybe the time to just eliminate all police forces for about 12 months and then reevaluate how we feel about policing after that time period. Of course those of you in Canada might feel a little different about that since you don’t have a second amendment. However, in the USA, there seems to be an overextended amount of criticism towards how we police so perhaps it’s just time to see what life is like without them completely.

https://www.kark.com/news/working4yo...regnant-woman/

[M5Rick]

A PIT on an suv will more than likely result in a flip, why can't people just pull over and STOP when obviously requested by an officer.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by br438

^^beat me to it. yours posted while I was typing... apparently very slowly. hahahahaa

1) glad the officer made it out alive - and reportedly fairly un-harmed! - hoping the same for everyone else.

2) What in Billy Bob Thornton's Dirty Southern Uncle is going on in that video!?

Officer has a 5 or 7 series pulled over.

M3 comes careening across the interstate backwards

Z4 slows down just enough to whisper bumpers at the "head-on" M3....

It's.... odd.

I don't think it's "odd"... the officer has a 7 series pulled over. The M3 wasn't backwards to begin with, he was trying to drift around the corner like an idiot, lost control of the drift and that's why it appeared to be going backwards by the time it hopped the median. The Z4 was probably travelling at a high rate of speed (as it's a highway) and slammed on the brakes when he saw that the M3 was about to come into oncoming traffic.

[Marcoose]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

A PIT on an suv will more than likely result in a flip, why can't people just pull over and STOP when obviously requested by an officer.

Because, sometimes, as shown, the policeman is the bad guy.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by Marcoose

Because, sometimes, as shown, the policeman is the bad guy.

In this situation I would have just pulled over even if there wasn't sufficient space on the side. If the officer then wants me to keep driving to a safer location, I'll let them signal me to do so.

I agree sometimes the policeman is the bad guy, but the reality is that bad guy has authority and I'm not going to do anything to further agitate said bad guy. Just not worth it. I understand the woman's intention for pulling over at a safer space, but unless there's an exit VERY nearby, I'm pulling over asap.

[Sneekypete]

Originally Posted by gopropham

Very true. 20mph over the limit is automatic reckless driving, which in VA, it's considered a class one misdemeanor.

Yep. I used to do the reverse commute from DC to Fairfax. Had to deal with this very issue - got hit doing 21 over in a speed trap (75 posted dropping to 55) coming back from Richmond. Had to hire an attorney because the way points transferred between VA and DC I would have had a suspended license for that one ticket. No other recent moving violations on my record.

FYI - Class 1 misdemeanor is the same charge as assault and battery or a DUI.

I try to spend as little time driving in that state as possible. VA troopers do not fuck around.

Very glad that officer was not injured.

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by Patton250

Why would the officer be held accountable for what was at the time a perfectly legal and required move? Was it a stupid policy? Of course it was and you see the result of it in this case. How is that the officers fault? This accident caused the rules and policy to be changed and I’m sure that lady got quite a bit of money from that department and rightfully so. This was a tragedy caused by a stupid authorized Police Department policy that has now been changed. See the article I posted.

I’m thinking now maybe the time to just eliminate all police forces for about 12 months and then reevaluate how we feel about policing after that time period. Of course those of you in Canada might feel a little different about that since you don’t have a second amendment. However, in the USA, there seems to be an overextended amount of criticism towards how we police so perhaps it’s just time to see what life is like without them completely.

https://www.kark.com/news/working4yo...regnant-woman/

Wow now I understand why there is no accountability in this society against LEO. People like you who are so blind and think this is totally ok

I'm not even sure if you are trolling or not here in your reply. Like seriously how can you say what the officer did is totally valid? In their policy they literally ALREADY had this that you can put hazards and pull over further down. Like holy hell man, how can you not see the issue?!?

Literally in the very article that you shared:
"Harper’s attorneys said they learned that every one of the trooper’s superiors determined the situation reflected a violation of ASP policy related to the PIT maneuver."

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by TheMidnightNarwhal

Wow now I understand why there is no accountability in this society against LEO. People like you who are so blind and think this is totally ok

I'm not even sure if you are trolling or not here in your reply.

I’m not trolling at all. Your emotions are meaningless in the situation and so are mine. I absolutely think that Officer is a jerk off for what he did but he followed policy rules and that’s why there’s nothing to hold him accountable for. If you and I don’t like that well too bad. Laws don’t care about our feelings. I hope that woman got rich off of that department. If I were her husband, I assure you, I would do my best to not be anywhere near that officer because I would probably kick his ass. Once again, our emotions have nothing to do with policy. Sorry if you don’t like that. I suppose you would rather have mob rules?

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

A PIT on an suv will more than likely result in a flip, why can't people just pull over and STOP when obviously requested by an officer.

Because Arkansas literally already had in their policy that you can put your hazards and pull over at a safe place if where you are is not already safe. Like this is literally what police told the citizens to do. And then everyone is up in arms against the citizen? Wow this reminds me of the McDonald hot coffee debacle and how McDonald made the media and people blame the victim when the reality was that McDonalds was negligent and lost in court.

https://www.nwahomepage.com/news/pol...ont-feel-safe/

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by Patton250

I’m not trolling at all. Your emotions are meaningless in the situation and so are mine. I absolutely think that Officer is a jerk off for what he did but he followed policy rules and that’s why there’s nothing to hold him accountable for. If you and I don’t like that well too bad. Laws don’t care about our feelings. I hope that woman got rich off of that department. If I were her husband, I assure you, I would do my best to not be anywhere near that officer because I would probably kick his ass. Once again, our emotions have nothing to do with policy. Sorry if you don’t like that. I suppose you would rather have mob rules?

But he literally did not follow policy omg Emotiosn aren't involved here, logic and common sense is. Man I am done here. I don't care about the laws, something that is lawful does not mean it is right or moral and again, that is ireelevant because he DID NOT FOLLOW POLICY.

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by TheMidnightNarwhal

But he literally did not follow policy omg Man I am done here. I don't care about the laws, something that is lawful does not mean it is right or moral and again, that is ireelevant because he DID NOT FOLLOW POLICY.

I provided the article for you. Why don’t you try clicking on it and reading it. They have since changed the policy. In the future a maneuver like that will be against policy. This is not very complicated. Once again, you’re just too emotional here. I’m glad you’re not a judge. Or a cop.

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by Patton250

I provided the article for you. Why don’t you try clicking on it and reading it. They have since changed the policy. In the future a maneuver like that will be against policy. This is not very complicated. Once again, you’re just too emotional here. I’m glad you’re not a judge. Or a cop.

And you seemingly did NOT read the article I provided in the thread that is 4 years before this incident occurred... why don't you try clicking on it and reading it? Again, emotions aren't involved here, just common sense and objectivity.

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by TheMidnightNarwhal

And you seemingly did NOT read the article I provided YOU that is 4 years before this incident occurred... why don't you try clicking on it and reading it? Again, emotions aren't involved here, just common sense and objectivity.

I’m sorry. I was not aware there were two accidents with pregnant women where the baby died and the department got sued. Both happening in Arkansas. Is that what you’re claiming? Lastly, what’s common sense to you has nothing to do with policy. You don’t seem to be getting this. I as well am tired of arguing about it. I agree with you on the emotional level. I already said that. I think the officer was a tool. I think what he did was stupid. I hope the woman gets rich. Is this not registering to you? But all of that has nothing to do with him performing a legal move at the time, and that’s why he’s not in legal trouble. This seems to be flying over your head at 10 times the speed of sound. you seem to think the man should be punished because you and I and probably many many others don’t like what he did.

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by Patton250

I’m sorry. I was not aware there were two accidents with pregnant women where the baby died and the department got sued. Both happening in Arkansas. Is that what you’re claiming? Lastly, what’s common sense to you has nothing to do with policy. You don’t seem to be getting this. I as well am tired of arguing about it. I agree with you on the emotional level. I already said that. I think the officer was a tool. I think what he did was stupid. I hope the woman gets rich. Is this not registering to you? But all of that has nothing to do with him performing a legal move at the time, and that’s why he’s not in legal trouble. This seems to be flying over your head at 10 times the speed of sound. you seem to think the man should be punished because you and I and probably many many others don’t like what he did.

No that is not what I am saying. But I concur I might not be on the same page either from what you are saying. Are you saying the policy was changed to allow people to use their hazards and pull over somewhere else? My article I link that is 4 years before the event shows that this policy already existed and the PD advertises people to do that which is why the officer used poor judgement here and should be held accountable. When you are a police, your job involves other humans and you can screw their lives up terribly. The consequences of doing your job poorly should be much higher from an objective standpoint for that reason. The way the law is written is disgusting and shields them, again not from an emotional standpoint, from an objective one. The fact that the PD settled in court goes to show their guilt. It goes back to my point that there is no real accountability and it's why these events where the officer acts poorly will continue to exist on and on. All that happened is money taken from taxpayers. Again, citizens paying for this BS. Yes the man should be punished for using poor judgment and a stupid decision causing issues ot others. He did NOT follow his policy...

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by TheMidnightNarwhal

No that is not what I am saying. But I concur I might not be on the same page either from what you are saying. Are you saying the policy was changed to allow people to use their hazards and pull over somewhere else? My article I link that is 4 years before the event shows that this policy already existed which is why the officer used poor judgement here and should be held accountable. When you are a police, your job involves other humans and you can screw their lives up terribly. The consequences of doing your job poorly should be much higher from an objective standpoint for that reason. The way the law is written is disgusting and shields them, again not from an emotional standpoint, from an objective one. The fact that the PD settled in court goes to show their guilt. It goes back to my point that there is no real accountability and it's why these events where the officer acts poorly will continue to exist on and on.

OK I think we are getting close now. I stopped reading after you said because they settled it shows their guilt. That is not the truth. The article I provided is from last November 2022. That article states that part of the settlement was them changing their policy from allowing that type of maneuver when people won’t pull over to not allowing it. The article, and many others I checked, didn’t go into any further detail than that. It also says that they came up with some undisclosed monetary settlement with the lady.

Listen, brother, I agree with everything you’ve said, as far as how stupid that policy was, and how dangerous it was. I’m not arguing with you on that. My only argument is the officer cannot be held accountable for following a legal policy of his department. That’s what he did as stupid as it was. Since then, the policy has been changed.

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by Patton250

OK I think we are getting close now. I stopped reading after you said because they settled it shows their guilt. That is not the truth. The article I provided is from last November 2022. That article states that part of the settlement was them changing their policy from allowing that type of maneuver when people won’t pull over to not allowing it. The article, and many others I checked, didn’t go into any further detail than that. It also says that they came up with some undisclosed monetary settlement with the lady.

Listen, brother, I agree with everything you’ve said, as far as how stupid that policy was, and how dangerous it was. I’m not arguing with you on that. My only argument is the officer cannot be held accountable for following a legal policy of his department. That’s what he did as stupid as it was. Since then, the policy has been changed.

Alright I'll wish you a good day as we do disagree with one another and we have our different viewpoints. Cheers