[Xpander]

Sorry automatic lovers, but driving a manual is like having sex without a condom on. You're much more connected with your 'ride'...STDs here I come!

[BTM]

Originally Posted by Xpander

Sorry automatic lovers, but driving a manual is like having sex without a condom on. You're much more connected with your 'ride'...STDs here I come!

Then auto is like getting a killer blowjob...sit back, relax, and enjoy

[captainaudio]

If you can't heel and toe, double clutch and perfectly match revs on a downshift you are not a manual transmission driver you a are manual tranmission owner.

I also would hate to see MTs dissappear.

CA

[Ewhacked]

I can't stand the thought of living in a world without MT's. Its like a manual trans. is the new dinosaur..That said...its amazing what having a wife will do to you when your buying a car! I miss the clutch...I still have PCFS (Phantom Clutch Foot Syndrome). I will just have to make due for now. But hey!...It sure does make getting road head easier...and for that

edit: If you or someone you love has PCFS, please contact your local BMW health provider.

[John 070]

Both of our cars are manuals, so my wife and I have no choice, whenever we leave the house in a car, there's a clutch. Interestingly, my wife said she liked the 328i steptronic loaner that we had for over a week. Most likely, our next vehicle will be an auto because it'll be a SUV.

We manual lovers are fighting a losing battle, the USA hates them because they inhibit multitasking while driving, and as someone mentioned, it's more relaxing to sit back and let the car do its thing. I find it hard to imagine Europe going to all autos, but give it some time, the world is changing.

[spitpilot]

Originally Posted by TJDiCandido

90% of new cars sold in the U.S. (to marginally competent American drivers) are equipped with automatic transmissions. However, almost 75% of the new cars sold in Europe are equipped with manual transmissions (Europeans are generally better drivers too). Thanks to European drivers, manual transmissions won’t be disappearing anytime soon.

Additionally, the traffic in London, Paris, Brussels, Rome, Athens, etc. is MUCH worse than almost anywhere in the U.S., yet European drivers seem to take city traffic in stride with manual transmission cars. Perhaps it's because Europeans aren't nearly as lazy as American drivers?

Actually its because most Europeans don't drive their cars in the city! Cities there are more compressed than here and for the most part have excellent public transport...so drivers there often only use their cars for longer trips inter city or in the countryside on weekends..where stick shift (ol school..no "manual" for me) add to the driving experience!...I"m drivin 6 speed..but hey I don't have "dalily grind" commute!

[Blue Liquid]

The thought of manual trannys going the way of the Dodo is heartbreaking, but I take some solace knowing that if it has to happen, it'll happen in the warm reassuring embrace of the BMW DCT. It's the next best thing.

[captainaudio]

I drove Manual Transmission cars and commuted between Manhattan and Long Island every day for years. Driving an MT in traffic never bothered me.

CA

[Nikolas]

Originally Posted by TJDiCandido

90% of new cars sold in the U.S. (to marginally competent American drivers) are equipped with automatic transmissions. However, almost 75% of the new cars sold in Europe are equipped with manual transmissions (Europeans are generally better drivers too). Thanks to European drivers, manual transmissions won’t be disappearing anytime soon.

Additionally, the traffic in London, Paris, Brussels, Rome, Athens, etc. is MUCH worse than almost anywhere in the U.S., yet European drivers seem to take city traffic in stride with manual transmission cars. Perhaps it's because Europeans aren't nearly as lazy as American drivers?

That's just crazy talk. No where in Europe is the traffic as bad as the states. Cities in Europe and even in rural areas utilize their incredible public transportation system which we do not have. Go drive on I5 in LA and get back to me.

[wstc]

Originally Posted by BTM

Then auto is like getting a killer blowjob...sit back, relax, and enjoy

from a man...

People I talk to who don't understand why I drive manual always throw either:
"F1 cars aren't manual"
or
"Ferrari's don't even come in manual"

F1s aren't manual because they need to turn in the fastest lap time.
Ferrari's don't come in manual because their target demographic don't want it.
The absence of manual in those do not equate to manual transmissions being antiquated in sports cars.

Yes auto's are faster, but you're not driving, you're steering. And don't give me that crap about how it let's you concentrate on finding the perfect line into a corner. A real driver will be able to handle shifting, rev matching, corner entry, etc, all at the same time.

Bottom line, if you're driving a sports car or anything claiming to be "sporty", it needs to be manual.

No one plays basketball riding in motorized wheelchairs that automatically take them around the court. Nor does anyone just stand in one place and shoot the ball from there. You need to dribble, sprint, dodge, shoot, etc all by yourself in order to be truly PLAYING BASKETBALL

[Edward]

^ why so furious?

[cstavaru]

Some interesting things:

The most hardcore Porsche car, the 911 GT3 RS, only comes with manual gearbox.

The most powerful Corvette, the ZR1, only comes with manual gearbox.

The 1-series M-coupe is rumored to only come with manual gearbox.

[captainaudio]

Originally Posted by wstc

from a man...

People I talk to who don't understand why I drive manual always throw either:
"F1 cars aren't manual"
or
"Ferrari's don't even come in manual"

F1s aren't manual because they need to turn in the fastest lap time.
Ferrari's don't come in manual because their target demographic don't want it.
The absence of manual in those do not equate to manual transmissions being antiquated in sports cars.

Yes auto's are faster, but you're not driving, you're steering. And don't give me that crap about how it let's you concentrate on finding the perfect line into a corner. A real driver will be able to handle shifting, rev matching, corner entry, etc, all at the same time.

Bottom line, if you're driving a sports car or anything claiming to be "sporty", it needs to be manual.

No one plays basketball riding in motorized wheelchairs that automatically take them around the court. Nor does anyone just stand in one place and shoot the ball from there. You need to dribble, sprint, dodge, shoot, etc all by yourself in order to be truly PLAYING BASKETBALL

So then it would logically follow that F1 drivers are just steering.

CA

[Bakeme521]

I have 2 friends whose first cars were both trucks, I taught them how to drive my 96 318ti which has a manual, and now both their second cars a manual bimmers. Just keep spreading the disease that it is!

[BTM]

Originally Posted by wstc

from a man...

Nice one...

People I talk to who don't understand why I drive manual always throw either:
"F1 cars aren't manual"
or
"Ferrari's don't even come in manual"

I've never once heard this brought up in an argument. FWIW Ferrari's push towards automated sequential manuals (used only in the sense that there's no torque converter) is only recent.

F1s aren't manual because they need to turn in the fastest lap time.
Ferrari's don't come in manual because their target demographic don't want it.
The absence of manual in those do not equate to manual transmissions being antiquated in sports cars.

I don't recall anyone making that argument, but the fact is that traditional manuals are nearing the end of their development life. There are newer, faster shifting, and more efficient types of transmissions manufacturers are choosing to develop, that are being received positively by the car buying public, enthusiasts included

Yes auto's are faster, but you're not driving, you're steering. And don't give me that crap about how it let's you concentrate on finding the perfect line into a corner. A real driver will be able to handle shifting, rev matching, corner entry, etc, all at the same time.

Bottom line, if you're driving a sports car or anything claiming to be "sporty", it needs to be manual.

No one plays basketball riding in motorized wheelchairs that automatically take them around the court. Nor does anyone just stand in one place and shoot the ball from there. You need to dribble, sprint, dodge, shoot, etc all by yourself in order to be truly PLAYING BASKETBALL

Who are you to ordain a sports car needs to have a traditional manual? Or to really be driving you need to be rev matching? This "manual drivers art better than thou" type attitude is one I will never understand. As you mentioned yourself, some of the fastest cars driven by the elite drivers in the world have sequential gearboxes, as do the highest end supercars, and not just Ferrari, but Lamborghini, Maserati, Aston Martin, etc. To imply my old 5sp Hyundai Accent is sportier than a Ferrari Enzo because it had a manual transmission is just, well, ridiculous. Generalizing a car's intrinsic character based on it's gearbox is taking an under-informed approach

A car's gearbox is only a piece of the equation, it's a tool to keep the car in the useable powerband, that's it. If you prefer rowing your own gears, so be it, that's your personal preference. There are occasions in which I do as well. If someone else, whatever their reason, likes the car to shift for them or to tug at some paddles to shift gears, that's their own decision. Judging them for it only makes you look ignorant

[Strongmad]

Originally Posted by captainaudio

So then it would logically follow that F1 drivers are just steering.

CA

Nah, they have a lot of little buttons to push on the steering wheel too. Also, if you are Sebastian Vettel, you have to take Mark Weber out at your earliest convenience also.

[Outlaw 06]

Originally Posted by spitpilot

Actually its because most Europeans don't drive their cars in the city! Cities there are more compressed than here and for the most part have excellent public transport...so drivers there often only use their cars for longer trips inter city or in the countryside on weekends..where stick shift (ol school..no "manual" for me) add to the driving experience!...I"m drivin 6 speed..but hey I don't have "dalily grind" commute!

Originally Posted by Nikolas

That's just crazy talk. No where in Europe is the traffic as bad as the states. Cities in Europe and even in rural areas utilize their incredible public transportation system which we do not have. Go drive on I5 in LA and get back to me.

Correct me if I'm missing something here, but it really doesn’t matter that “most” European city dwellers use public transportation because their city street traffic is still horrendous anyway. The rush-hour traffic in the European cities that I mentioned is generally worse than Boston, New York City, Washington DC, and LA (these American cities all have ample public transportation options that don't seem to reduce traffic congestion much either). The bottom line is that European city drivers routinely negotiate incessant bumper-to-bumper traffic in their manual transmission cars... IMO, "traffic congestion" is just a lame excuse that many Americans use to justify buying their slushbox-equipped cars.

[BTM]

Originally Posted by TJDiCandido

The bottom line is that European city drivers routinely negotiate incessant bumper-to-bumper traffic in their manual transmission cars... IMO, "traffic congestion" is just a lame excuse that many Americans use to justify buying their slushbox-equipped cars.

Is it not easier to drive an auto in traffic?

Who knows why Europe is much more predisposed to buying manual cars, but a personal theory that I'd wager plays a role is their gas prices. Not long ago, the difference in MPG between MT and AT was quite significant, only recently have autos been able to close that gap. Given that most Europeans pay much more for gas than those of us in the US, I'm not surprised the propensity for buying manual cars still exists there

[spitpilot]

I've never bought an auto car...taught my wife to drive stick on an Alfa GTV...small displacement, huge carburation...very hard learning (We're still married..LOL) My kid's didn't get to drive until they (daughter also) could do a good job with stick shift and not fry the clutch!...Why? Shifting for yourself and working a clutch KEEPS YOUR HEAD IN THE GAME! You ever read about someone with a stick shift driving thru their garage door?...Plus, if you go out partying and ride with someone who has a stick...you want to be able to say "give me the keys" if they overdo it! Safety there!...My next car will probably be some hybrid golf cart if the "greenies" have their say in what can and can't be sold as a car...in the meantime I'm enjoyin "rowin thru the gears"...just have to remember to make that one more shift into 6th!...

[vasillalov]

Originally Posted by TJDiCandido

90% of new cars sold in the U.S. (to marginally competent American drivers) are equipped with automatic transmissions. However, almost 75% of the new cars sold in Europe are equipped with manual transmissions (Europeans are generally better drivers too). Thanks to European drivers, manual transmissions won’t be disappearing anytime soon.

Additionally, the traffic in London, Paris, Brussels, Rome, Athens, etc. is MUCH worse than almost anywhere in the U.S., yet European drivers seem to take city traffic in stride with manual transmission cars. Perhaps it's because Europeans aren't nearly as lazy as American drivers?

BINGO!

What do you expect? This is the nation that insists on having cup holders large enough to put a 64oz double gulp "bucket" from 7-11.

[vasillalov]

Originally Posted by BTM

Is it not easier to drive an auto in traffic?

Who knows why Europe is much more predisposed to buying manual cars, but a personal theory that I'd wager plays a role is their gas prices.

1. It is easier to drive manual. You simply have more control. You can PRECISELY dial in how much power is going to the wheels via the clutch. With the auto/dtc transmissions the power is either on or off.

2. In winder/mud conditions you cannot "rock" the car in the snow with auto/dtc the same way you can with manual.

3. Manual transmissions are cheaper to buy, cheaper to repair and cheaper to own in the long run. In the US that is bit of a mute point but in Europe and the rest of the world it is VERY important due to the different taxes. An example: my 335I was sold to its first owner for $47K. The EXACT same car with exact same options would have cost around 115K euros in Europe.

4. In Europe, it is mandated that you learn to drive a manual car. You cannot get your driver's license unless you did your drivers education in a manual car and you have to pass the driver's test in a manual car also. ...at least this is how it is in most Eastern European countries. I do see this rule being relaxed though...

[BTM]

I disagree about being easier to drive in traffic, it's a lot easier IMO to just modulate the brake...it's not on/off as you suggest...it's possible to creep forward slower or faster based on how much pressure I apply. And while I've only been driving for 8 years I've never had to rock my car to get unstuck with either transmission...