[I Luv BMW]

Most cost effective way to slap a turbo onto a Mirage.

[Brandoch]

Does this count?

[T.R.S.]

Seems that at least a few that so readily mock/condemn are actually living much of their lives behind "fake badges".

[bucketfoot]

Originally Posted by T.R.S.

Seems that at least a few that so readily mock/condemn are actually living much of their lives behind "fake badges".

Yep, I will stand by my statement that my 230i with the MSport package is every bit as real or fake of an "M car" as the M240i, let alone the Mini based M235 Gran Coupe.

In my book the only current production M cars are: M2, M3, M4, M5 & M8

[Joe-BMW33]

Originally Posted by bucketfoot

Yep, I will stand by my statement that my 230i with the MSport package is every bit as real or fake of an "M car" as the M240i, let alone the Mini based M235 Gran Coupe.

In my book the only current production M cars are: M2, M3, M4, M5 & M8

I am old school. I personally don't count the M2 as a real M car. It's just marketing and similar to slapping M's around on all the other m sport models. It's a cheap/affordable way to make the consumer think they have a real M car. The real M cars are the M3 and M5, period, with consideration for the M4 because it represents when the M3 was a coupe.

X SUV's definitely aren't M cars. Don't know how I feel about the M8, but it's going away anyway. M cars don't usually go away with the exception of classics like the almost concept car M1.

It's all become a lot of marketing for BMW. The 1 and 2 series should have just been outsourced to Toyota as Corrola's and Celica's. The "1M", OMG, that's just an embarrassing badge.

[bucketfoot]

Originally Posted by Joe-BMW33

I am old school. I personally don't count the M2 as a real M car. It's just marketing and similar to slapping M's around on all the other m sport models. It's a cheap/affordable way to make the consumer think they have a real M car. The real M cars are the M3 and M5, period, with consideration for the M4 because it represents when the M3 was a coupe.

X SUV's definitely aren't M cars. Don't know how I feel about the M8, but it's going away anyway. M cars don't usually go away with the exception of classics like the almost concept car M1.

It's all become a lot of marketing for BMW. The 1 and 2 series should have just been outsourced to Toyota as Corrola's and Celica's. The "1M", OMG, that's just an embarrassing badge.

I had to think about the M8 myself and could go either way. But frankly I think the M2 is most "M" of all of them and is closer to what an M car has been in the past than the current 3/4/5. Just my $0.02 though

100% agree that the X SUVs are not M cars.

[Joe-BMW33]

Originally Posted by bucketfoot

I had to think about the M8 myself and could go either way. But frankly I think the M2 is most "M" of all of them and is closer to what an M car has been in the past than the current 3/4/5. Just my $0.02 though

100% agree that the X SUVs are not M cars.

I guess I am old school, or just old, lol! A little down on BMW lately for brand and model confusion. Too many friggin models and variants within them. Then there is the whole friggin "i" thing.

For 30 years, I always knew what my next BMW was going to be a few years after buying the current one. Nothing in the new line-up interests me, especially aesthetically.

I will probably pull the trigger on a 2023 F90 in the next few months and garage it mostly. Last all ICE M5.

[Yuille36]

We all have are own opinions on what is or isn’t an M Car. I own both a F80 M3 and a F85 X5M and I consider them both M Cars, they both definitely came with ///M tax.

But all M cars were developed from regular cars, so the X5M is an M.

[Joe-BMW33]

Originally Posted by Yuille36

We all have are own opinions on what is or isn’t an M Car. I own both a F80 M3 and a F85 X5M and I consider them both M Cars, they both definitely came with ///M tax.

But all M cars were developed from regular cars, so the X5M is an M.

Oh for sure BMW slapping an ///M on an X5 most definitely brings the M tax, that's kind of the motivation.

///M to me is not about status, it is about performance, specifically handling. SUV's just can't achieve that. It's physics and geometry.

That said, the X5M is a badass vehicle. Bought an X5 a few years ago for the girlfriend and they had one in the showroom. Definitely would be my choice if I would entertain driving a BMW SUV daily. She could have cared less.

[bucketfoot]

Originally Posted by Joe-BMW33

///M to me is not about status, it is about performance, specifically handling. SUV's just can't achieve that. It's physics and geometry.

This...

That said, I'm not going to say that any of the XM vehicles are not amazing pieces of engineering. SUVs should not be able to do the $h!+ that modern ones can.

But frankly (and I may get flamed bigtime for this) I liken these crazy SUVs more so to something like a Tesla than an M car. Straight line speed, and they handle surprisingly well for what they are. But I'd take my wife's old 02 Camry of my daughter's Fit to the track over one of these.

All of that said, quite frankly I don't give a damn what BMW does or does not call an ///M. As alluded to, for BMW it's really all about the extra ///M tax they can collect from people.

Going back to my earlier comment... my 230i with the MSport package is every bit as real or fake of an "M car" as the M240i, let alone the Mini based M235 Gran Coupe. So no skin off my nose on any of this

[Tejas1836]

What is the definition of a "true M vehicle"?

[dumptruck]

[bucketfoot]

Originally Posted by Tejas1836

What is the definition of a "true M vehicle"?

Realistically it is whatever BMW wants it to be.

Which today is an automobile that BMW chooses to put M badges on anywhere on the exterior or interior of the vehicle.

For me, since M came from BMW motorsports, it is a car (not SUV/SAV/CUV) with factory tuning beyond the base family that has added performance (be it engine, transmission, suspension, aerodynamics, etc.) for combined street/track performance.

But then hell, NASCAR races trucks. So who in the hell am I to say an SUV/SAV can't be a track car. Hell my first track car was an E84 X1 SAV

[Joe-BMW33]

Originally Posted by Tejas1836

What is the definition of a "true M vehicle"?

That conversation would be better over a few pitchers of beers. My treat. If you ever drove an E30 M3 or E39 M5, you would know. Drivers cars, which will prompt the question, what is a drivers car? More pitchers of beers.

[erickonphoenix]

Originally Posted by bucketfoot

Realistically it is whatever BMW wants it to be.

Which today is an automobile that BMW chooses to put M badges on anywhere on the exterior on interior of the vehicle.

For me, since M came from BMW motorsports, it is a car (not SUV/SAV/CUV) with factory tuning beyond the base family that has added performance (be it engine, transmission, suspension, aerodynamics, etc.) for combined street/track performance.

But then hell, NASCAR races trucks. So who in the hell am I to say an SUV/SAV can't be a track car. Hell my first track car was an E84 X1 SAV

I completely agree, BMW marketing should be very careful messing with the brand equity of the M badge. Personally, if I upgraded to an M240 or M340 I'd shave that badge off. They're not M cars.

Classes of racing range from prototype all the way to stock cars so I don't have an issue with trucks or SUVs racing. I prefer prototype racing but still enjoy sports car and stock car racing if it's on.

[I Luv BMW]

All interesting points. I guess the point of this thread is - the car in the photo has badges which didn’t come from factory. It is objective. Not whether any car is “deserving” of the badge. Clearly that is a whole separate and lengthy discussion.

Obviously people can do whatever they want with their cars and posting a photo of a car with a fake badge is not necessarily a statement of - the car that I drive is more of an M (or whatever else) than the particular car. If that was the case then this thread should only be for a drivers of a select few M models.

Doesn’t matter if you drive a 118i or M5 (insert series). A fake badge is still a fake badge.

[bucketfoot]

Originally Posted by I Luv BMW

Doesn’t matter if you drive a 118i or M5 (insert series). A fake badge is still a fake badge.

I definitely get what you are saying.

But what if your car came from the factory with a bunch of ///M badges (wheels, calipers, interior), because it has the MSport package, and you were to add another one in a different location...

[I Luv BMW]

Originally Posted by bucketfoot

I definitely get what you are saying.

But what if your car came from the factory with a bunch of ///M badges (wheels, calipers, interior), because it has the MSport package, and you were to add another one in a different location...

Haha! I don’t know the answer to that question. But having previously owned a non-M vehicle with M-sport package I would say that those vehicles come from factory with enough M badges sprinkled as they are


But I do get what you’re getting at.

[bucketfoot]

Originally Posted by I Luv BMW

Haha! I don’t know the answer to that question. But having previously owned a non-M vehicle with M-sport package I would say that those vehicles come from factory with enough M badges sprinkled as they are

No matter what your thoughts, I'm guessing that we can all agree that BMW has confused the hell out of ///M

[IDBGOD]

BMW is just following with other automakers. Same can be said about AMG, etc.

I really don’t care what others choose to do or not do to their vehicles. Real enthusiasts know what the car is, and the people they are tying to fool don’t even know what an //M is anyway. They just know it’s a BMW.

It does give me a chuckle every once in a while seeing the level of poser some people go (hence this thread lol) but to each their own.

[Brandoch]

Let's get this thread back on track.

[Kaizer84]

The SUV’s are always the one’s.