[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by spuntyb

Agreed. They cite lackluster wagon sales while only giving us a turbo-4 with AWD, and one tranny option. That's all fine, but give us some options here. Even the original X1 had a turbo-6 option for crying out loud, and that thing was the medical alert bracelet of cars. (I kid)

While BMW limited the options for F31 for all of North America, at least you guys still have options for the F30/F32/F36. In Canada, everything comes with xDrive and 8-Speed AT as standard, with no option of RWD and manual except on the 40i models. It was bad enough that if you wanted a straight-six, you had to go for the 35i/40i. BMW is now forcing you to buy the top trim if you want anything resembling a traditional BMW (manual transmission + straight-six engine) which I think is BS.

[bmwmnation]

Can we just have a supercar? Fuck all of this other shit lol.

[sward]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

There is a slight refresh of the X5 and X6 coming soon. Although there are no dramatic changes, just slight refresh with updated features but no major exterior work. Think of something on par with the BMW i3 in which exterior wise nothing is different. The F15 X5 is days away from its third birthday so its arrival will not seem as short as it appears to be.

Is it only iDrive 5.0 with touch, wifi, wireless charging, Apple CarPlay and new rear entertainment coming or is it more features? Engines (especially M50d)? Wheels? Interior updates?

Is it coming as the 2017 year model in August or later?

I'm about to order a replacement for my 2014 X5 M50d (100000km) and I'm aiming for an October production. Will all of these updates be available in October?

[1230vani]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

There is a slight refresh of the X5 and X6 coming soon. Although there are no dramatic changes, just slight refresh with updated features but no major exterior work. Think of something on par with the BMW i3 in which exterior wise nothing is different. The F15 X5 is days away from its third birthday so its arrival will not seem as short as it appears to be.

Thank you for this info. Already ordered mine and would like to know why no ACtive Steering option for 2017 model and no alternative to it?

[marcel b]

Originally Posted by the_phew

Personally, the 3 Touring died for me with the E91, since the F31 doesn't offer RWD or a 6MT. A decent condition E91 RWD 6MT basically never depreciated, even more so if it was an M-sport. The F31 occupies a weird spot, because it is $50k+ but isn't overtly sporty (lifted ride height, open diffs, no 6MT, not that quick, etc.) nor overtly luxurious. I'd rather give up a foot of cargo length and just get a true sporty AWD hatch like the Focus RS or Golf R and pocket $10k+, or spend the same to be swaddled in a luxurious/ stylish V90, or spend a bit more to get totally ostentatious luxury (E wagon)-with awesome rear-facing jump seats to boot!

RWD is available in EU, I have a 340i rwd myself. Regarding manual you are right, but to be honest the 8gear sport automatic is great. It also holds the gears in manual! (I always disliked to autoshift up in manual when hitting rev limit)
With the performance LSD in the back it is a joy to drive.

[CSBM5]

Originally Posted by the_phew

Here's the thing that BMW product managers fail to understand: wagon buyers (in the U.S.) may not be high-volume customers, but they are the best kind of customers. They are the brand loyalists/enthusiasts/BMW CCA members/etc. They are the "car guy/gal" in their peer group (the one who everyone asks for car shopping advice), the coveted "social media influencers" that savvy companies fall over themselves to court.

The above described customer is precisely the one that BMWNA cares the least about. They fully believe the above will continue to flock to the brand under the manta of "build it and they will come." It's all about value extraction of the last few decades of customer good will and no longer about the long term health of the corporation. Since what gets rewarded is what gets done, the faster you can extract that goodwill value from the marketplace, the greater the short term reward. You look brilliant. A superstar in fact. Financials never look better than at the top of a value extraction created bubble. It's that value of the short term reward that blinds even "very smart people/boards" to the long term discontinuity they are creating for the corporation.

The bubble already popped on BMW most likely...they just don't realize it yet. Well, their shareholders sure do realize it I suppose given the stock is down 45% in the past 15 months.

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by CSBM5

The above described customer is precisely the one that BMWNA cares the least about. They fully believe the above will continue to flock to the brand under the manta of "build it and they will come." It's all about value extraction of the last few decades of customer good will and no longer about the long term health of the corporation. Since what gets rewarded is what gets done, the faster you can extract that goodwill value from the marketplace, the greater the short term reward. You look brilliant. A superstar in fact. Financials never look better than at the top of a value extraction created bubble. It's that value of the short term reward that blinds even "very smart people/boards" to the long term discontinuity they are creating for the corporation.

The bubble already popped on BMW most likely...they just don't realize it yet. Well, their shareholders sure do realize it I suppose given the stock is down 45% in the past 15 months.

The main obstacle isn't recognized though. Costs to adapt each model and sub-variants that have significantly different configurations to US conformity. Station Wagon variants (not cross-overs or SUV's) have an additional challenge.

For those who think it's a poor decision, what do you think the cost to bring the F31 in its two configurations to conformity was?

[Gonven]

Originally Posted by ynguldyn

Biggish update in the first post. Enjoy.

First of all thanks for all this great info, like always
Do you know at what time X3M and X4M will start appear?

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by ynguldyn

Biggish update in the first post. Enjoy.

Thank you for your extremely informative and valuable contributions.

I did a little clean-up on the OP to try and make the information as organized as I could. If anything is not to your liking, please do not hesitate to edit as you see fit.

To me one of the bigger tidbits in your most recent update is the confirmation of an X2 M35i. Most significantly, this indicates that BMW is finally putting serious effort into high performance iterations of the B46/B48. It will be interesting to see if they follow up with even more power (S48?) to take on Mercedes and Volvo who are quickly headed toward 400hp with their 2L turbocharged engines.

By the way, any thoughts on the surprising (to me, anyway) announcement from BMW NA of an MY2017 F10 M5? The big question to me is, will they now allow it to be produced past 10/16, signaling a new strategy whereby M products are allowed to live on beyond the series counterpart? This is theoretically possible since the new F90 M5 won't be ready until MY2018 at the earliest, and perhaps it will even be called an MY2019 depending on its exact release date.

[the_phew]

Originally Posted by miamiten

For those who think it's a poor decision, what do you think the cost to bring the F31 in its two configurations to conformity was?

Roughly the same as the 3GT in its two configurations.

The 3GT might generate similar sales, but it does nothing to further the brand as a whole (in the U.S.; I know China inexplicably loves those GT abominations). There is an owner near me with the license plate "E91 6MT" on his/her white M-sport E91; clearly an enthusiast that's worth a sh!t ton to the brand thanks to their brand evangelism. I don't have the willpower to search all 50 DMV sites for available vanity plates, but I guarantee "F34 8AT" is available in all 50 states, unless it's taken by sheer random coincidence.

[antzcrashing]

Originally Posted by kmarei

You don't think the $9000 price difference is affecting sales of the wagon?

Not really a fair comparison
Almost every BMW model sold in the states outsells the Z4, but its still available for sale no?
If it was about shifting priorities, then it would make sense to stop selling the Z4.

Dont give them ideas....

[bueller]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

While BMW limited the options for F31 for all of North America, at least you guys still have options for the F30/F32/F36. In Canada, everything comes with xDrive and 8-Speed AT as standard, with no option of RWD and manual except on the 40i models. It was bad enough that if you wanted a straight-six, you had to go for the 35i/40i. BMW is now forcing you to buy the top trim if you want anything resembling a traditional BMW (manual transmission + straight-six engine) which I think is BS.

I agree, while I like my wagon, I don't love it. I would love it with a manual, RWD, and I6. If you think about it, BMW seems to like to fill every conceivable niche, I don't understand why they would not seize the opportunity to import a true "sport" wagon, as nobody else offers one.

I call BS on the "they want you to buy a X1 -2 -3 argument. If I wanted an SUV I would get a Macan, I would buy an M3 wagon in a heartbeat...

I don't understand why they offer the F31 in what is essentially mini SUV trim (auto, XDrive, and less robust engine) then say people are not interested in wagons. Most enthusiasts I have met think wagons are cool, they don't buy them because they enjoy driving, and usually gravitate towards RWD and manual.

For people known for their logic, I think ze Germans are making flawed assumptions about their customers, or at least missing an opportunity.

B.

[111R]

Is it true that BMW is building a plant in Mexico that will build 3 series for the US market? If the wagon was built there as well, it might be profitable.

Regardless, I think that most manufacturers selling cars in the US have given up on wagons in favor of small SUVs and the like. Americans have been brainwashed into taking a hit on performance in order to 'sit up high'. Some folks have a need for these vehicles if they carry bulky items or go off-road on a regular basis, but most people's needs would be met with a wagon.

I think the catalyst for this thinking is the proliferation of large pickups, which can be intimidating in the rear view mirror of a normal car. I sometimes ask people considering SUVs what the upper limit of this will be. It's an arms race, the end result of which may be everyone driving around in Peterbilts.

[Jason]

Originally Posted by 111R

Is it true that BMW is building a plant in Mexico that will build 3 series for the US market? If the wagon was built there as well, it might be profitable.

Regardless, I think that most manufacturers selling cars in the US have given up on wagons in favor of small SUVs and the like. Americans have been brainwashed into taking a hit on performance in order to 'sit up high'. Some folks have a need for these vehicles if they carry bulky items or go off-road on a regular basis, but most people's needs would be met with a wagon.

I think the catalyst for this thinking is the proliferation of large pickups, which can be intimidating in the rear view mirror of a normal car. I sometimes ask people considering SUVs what the upper limit of this will be. It's an arms race, the end result of which may be everyone driving around in Peterbilts.

Yes, please see homepage for the announcement on the Mexico plant - http://www.bimmerpost.com

[Jason]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

By the way, any thoughts on the surprising (to me, anyway) announcement from BMW NA of an MY2017 F10 M5? The big question to me is, will they now allow it to be produced past 10/16, signaling a new strategy whereby M products are allowed to live on beyond the series counterpart? This is theoretically possible since the new F90 M5 won't be ready until MY2018 at the earliest, and perhaps it will even be called an MY2019 depending on its exact release date.

Update from BMW NA: The 2017 M5 was a misprint in the press release. There will be no model year 2017 M5, and the F10 M5's final model year will be as a 2016.

[vladberca]

Great products are around the corner. ☺

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by 111R

Is it true that BMW is building a plant in Mexico that will build 3 series for the US market? If the wagon was built there as well, it might be profitable.

That won't help. Until the Trans-Atlantic Harmonized Vehicle Standards are fully implemented, it makes it cost prohibitive.

When I was with Audi we looked into bringing the B7 RS4 Avant to the US. The expense to revise the rear structure and potentially meet the requirements was over $10million. In addition, NHTSA required 18 modified prototypes to begin testing with an additional 2 production spec cars if they passed without issue to grant conformity. All in it was close to $30m.

I'm a wagon fan and would love to have an M5 Touring. But that has absolutely no chance even with the Harmonized Standards in effect.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by Jason

Update from BMW NA: The 2017 M5 was a misprint in the press release. There will be no model year 2017 M5, and the F10 M5's final model year will be as a 2016.

Thank you for confirming that, Jason. That makes a hell of a lot more sense.

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by Jason

Update from BMW NA: The 2017 M5 was a misprint in the press release. There will be no model year 2017 M5, and the F10 M5's final model year will be as a 2016.

Would you check and verify personally the errors regarding M Driver's Package. My understanding is that for M2 it should read "is now available as a stand alone option" rather than "is not available as a standalone option." The other M's seem to be tied to something or an aftersales retrofit.

[5against8]

Any rough estimate on X2 SOP?

[xlover]

Any word on if the xdrive suspension on the G20 will be a compromised version like on the Fseries of vehicles

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by xlover

Any word on if the xdrive suspension on the G20 will be a compromised version like on the Fseries of vehicles

G30 will be unveiled very soon. Some models will preview the some G20 components including front axle systems.