[ybbiz34]

Originally Posted by rjd598

find it funny how the m3 is only mentioned ONCE in a "review". hmmmmm

Probably because they're going to have a proper head-to-head comparison of the cars (with perhaps a third competitor in the mix) sometime this season.

Clarkson drove the F80 on last week's episode and loved it. In case you missed it: http://21topgear.com/bmw-m4-vs-bmw-i8/

[hellrotm]

Good Top Gear review. Third review I read today that would choose the C63 over the M3.

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by BlackJetE90

Good Top Gear review. Third review I read today that would choose the C63 over the M3.

The interior is the kicker. From what I've read, the conclusions on the F8X and the W205 are the same as they were with the E9X and W204. The M3/M4 is still probably the better track car and the C63 is the better road car. Add the ridiculously amazing interior of the C63, if you're not going to track your car (like many aren't), why wouldn't you pick the C63 as a daily driver?

[ybbiz34]

Originally Posted by BlackJetE90

Good Top Gear review. Third review I read today that would choose the C63 over the M3.

I hope we see the C63 tested this upcoming Sunday. I would also love to see a head-to-head pitting the F8X against the W205 and the ATS-V (although I suppose it is more likely we'd see the RC-F).

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

The interior is the kicker. From what I've read, the conclusions on the F8X and the W205 are the same as they were with the E9X and W204. The M3/M4 is still probably the better track car and the C63 is the better road car. Add the ridiculously amazing interior of the C63, if you're not going to track your car (like many aren't), why wouldn't you pick the C63 as a daily driver?

Exciting times for enthusiasts.

For those that think the W205's styling is too tame, there is always the new AMG GT3:

[YungDro]

Originally Posted by Yasmarina

New C-class too S-class looking for my taste..

but there's the coupe version on it's way to come.. and I do like the estate..

if the new C coupe looks like the S class coupe i know some would hate it but i wouldnt mind it

[YungDro]

Originally Posted by ybbiz34

I hope we see the C63 tested this upcoming Sunday. I would also love to see a head-to-head pitting the F8X against the W205 and the ATS-V (although I suppose it is more likely we'd see the RC-F).

it wont be in this weeks episode they will be showing the RC-F

[YungDro]

Originally Posted by BlackJetE90

Good Top Gear review. Third review I read today that would choose the C63 over the M3.

all reviews are comparing the C63 S to the M3.. they should compare the normal C63 to it untill a comp pack M3 is out..

[ai388]

looking forward to the new C coupe

[Properstyle]

Originally Posted by YungDro

all reviews are comparing the C63 S to the M3.. they should compare the normal C63 to it untill a comp pack M3 is out..

A full optioned m3 f80 is a comparable c63s look at the options

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by Properstyle

A full optioned m3 f80 is a comparable c63s look at the options

Yeah...in price. There is a base C63 that would more appropriate to compare to the M3/M4.

[Properstyle]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

Yeah...in price. There is a base C63 that would more appropriate to compare to the M3/M4.

Yet the m3 that is often even used has Carbon ceramic which DO NOT come on the BASE m3. The m3 in a comp package wouln't even be coming with more as it's not something m is known for. E46 m3 comp only came with bigger brakes, different wheels, and m-mode. E9x was wheels stiffer springs, and interior options. The new m model gives you so many options to choose there will likely never been a specifed comp package.

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by Properstyle

Yet the m3 that is often even used has Carbon ceramic which DO NOT come on the BASE m3. The m3 in a comp package wouln't even be coming with more as it's not something m is known for. E46 m3 comp only came with bigger brakes, different wheels, and m-mode. E9x was wheels stiffer springs, and interior options. The new m model gives you so many options to choose there will likely never been a specifed comp package.

You're comparing the use of ceramics that do nothing in the real world and do not affect the way the M3/M4 drives in the real world to a car that is beefed up to 500+ horsepower and torque which is felt in the real world.

There won't be a competition pack? The E9X M3 had one and so does the F10 M5. The competition pack is only mentioned because there is a chance BMW might do the same thing to the M3 as they did with the M5 competition pack which slightly increases HP and various chassis tweaks which makes a lot more sense to compare to a C63S instead of comparing the base M3/M4 to it when there is a base C63.

[Properstyle]

Are you serious? Ceramics do nothing while the test they are doing are throwing the car around on a track? Did you think that through? They also are using the carbon fiber roof m3/m4 which is also not the base and take a large chunk of weigh away from the car. The list does go on. They are not using a base m3 so why do they need to use a base model c63 that's much heavier? For kicks and giggles let's use logic. Ad giving most of the test drives are with the m4 not the m3 should we say that's unfair as well since the c63coupe isn't out? Come on. The m3 is lighter and if I you do the power to weight ratio by book numbers actually makes the same if not more power than the c63s so what is the issue? 50hp really?

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by Properstyle

Are you serious? Ceramics do nothing while the test they are doing are throwing the car around on a track? Did you think that through? They also are using the carbon fiber roof m3/m4 which is also not the base and take a large chunk of weigh away from the car. The list does go on. They are not using a base m3 so why do they need to use a base model c63 that's much heavier? For kicks and giggles let's use logic. Ad giving most of the test drives are with the m4 not the m3 should we say that's unfair as well since the c63coupe isn't out? Come on. The m3 is lighter and if I you do the power to weight ratio by book numbers actually makes the same if not more power than the c63s so what is the issue? 50hp really?

Wow. When we use the term base, we're not talking about bone stock with no options. Base = lowest model/trim available. Even if you were confused by the terminology, the C63S is NOT the true competitor to the M3/M4, it's pretty obvious and there is no discussion to be had. Is the W204 C63 AMG Black Series a competitor to the base E9X M3?

FYI. Both the M3/M4 come with the carbon fibre roof as standard, the sunroof/moonroof is optional.

Who says it's unfair that they use the M3 or the M4? The only people who complain are the people who actually think the sedan is significantly different then the M4. They're pretty much the exact same car with different amount of doors with 10 pounds separating them, hardly anything to cry about.

You think the HP increase is nothing significant? Try to put it into context. The M3/M4 has only 425HP/406TQ. The base C63 has 469HP/479TQ. The C63S has 503HP/516TQ. In what world is a difference of 78HP negligible? Let's add weight:

M3/M4: 3540lbs/425HP = 8.3lbs/HP
C63 AMG: 3615lbs/469HP = 7.7lbs/HP
C63S AMG: 3650/503HP = 7.2lbs/HP

If you want to compare a M3/M4 to a C63S just to see how it stacks up, cool but in no way are they direct competitors especially when you have a base C63 there that already stacks up well with the M3/M4.

I can't be the only one who feels/thinks this way. Correct me if I'm wrong.

[hellrotm]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

Wow. When we use the term base, we're not talking about bone stock with no options. Base = lowest model/trim available. Even if you were confused by the terminology, the C63S is NOT the true competitor to the M3/M4, it's pretty obvious and there is no discussion to be had. Is the W204 C63 AMG Black Series a competitor to the base E9X M3?

That is never how mag comparos work. The respective brands send their best for each segment. So until the competition package M3 arrives, C63S will go up against heavily optioned M3's.

W204 Black Series is competitor to the E92 GTS.

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by BlackJetE90

That is never how mag comparos work. The respective brands send their best for each segment. So until the competition package M3 arrives, C63S will go up against heavily optioned M3's.

W204 Black Series is competitor to the E92 GTS.

Correct, there's nothing wrong with comparing a M3/M4 to the C63S but don't tell me the C63S is the natural competitor to the M3/M4. Should we take a W204 Black Series and comparing it to a E9X M3? We could but would that tell us anything other than a more beefed up version of the C63 that costs a lot more is better than the M3? And heavily optioning a M3/M4 does nothing because none of those options really improve the car like the "S" variant does to the C63. The only thing you do is bring the price up to match the C63S. Ok you can throw on ceramics and on the track they're effective how much of a difference is there? If anything you don't want the options, aside from the ceramics, the remaining options are just electronic bells and whistles which probably add more weight than anything.

I can read any comparison between the C63S and M3/M4 and not have a problem with it because I know the C63S has the advantage here. Bit it's unfortunate we can't read about how the C63 in it's base form compares to the M3/M4 which would be a hell of a lot more informational. It's not like the C63 wasn't provided to the media, both cars were present but everyone chooses to pick the C63S to write and compare about.

[Inspired]

Love the front end. The rear is lacking the aggressiveness.

Would love to own one just for that insane power. If only they came in AWD...

[Properstyle]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

Wow. When we use the term base, we're not talking about bone stock with no options. Base = lowest model/trim available. Even if you were confused by the terminology, the C63S is NOT the true competitor to the M3/M4, it's pretty obvious and there is no discussion to be had. Is the W204 C63 AMG Black Series a competitor to the base E9X M3?

FYI. Both the M3/M4 come with the carbon fibre roof as standard, the sunroof/moonroof is optional.

Who says it's unfair that they use the M3 or the M4? The only people who complain are the people who actually think the sedan is significantly different then the M4. They're pretty much the exact same car with different amount of doors with 10 pounds separating them, hardly anything to cry about.

You think the HP increase is nothing significant? Try to put it into context. The M3/M4 has only 425HP/406TQ. The base C63 has 469HP/479TQ. The C63S has 503HP/516TQ. In what world is a difference of 78HP negligible? Let's add weight:

M3/M4: 3540lbs/425HP = 8.3lbs/HP
C63 AMG: 3615lbs/469HP = 7.7lbs/HP
C63S AMG: 3650/503HP = 7.2lbs/HP

If you want to compare a M3/M4 to a C63S just to see how it stacks up, cool but in no way are they direct competitors especially when you have a base C63 there that already stacks up well with the M3/M4.

I can't be the only one who feels/thinks this way. Correct me if I'm wrong.

You all realize the base c63 has never been compared to the m3 right? Here some info the c63s vagrant has always been around it was referred to as the p30 and later p31 package and guess what, in a naturally aspirated motor it made more power than a base c63. And no one bat an eye at that. Oh well why is that because they had no idea the difference. Even now when a m3 owner pulls up to a c63 on the high way they have no clue there are 3 different versions of the coupe and the sedan and then the black series. So why are you crying now. Benz has always been the muscle car of the group while m diversion has always been lighter and more nimble. Holy crap

Base c63 w204 didn't come with a LSD it was a option to added, It didn't come with floatin rotors it was an option, it didn't come with forged internals that wa also an option to add and they fell under the 507 package or the P31 package which when ever a test drive wa done it was using the p30/p31 package car.

2015 m3 weight of 3,516 lb= 8.1lbs/hp

2015 C63S weight 3786lb= 7.5lbs/hp

Correct numbers taken from BMW and Benz not google. The c63 has a slight power advantge but as I've already stated this has been true since the c55 the benz has alway made more power than the m division in every model. Your more wrapped up in power numbers and not even the electrical diff that comes with the C63S lol...

Further more None of you complained when they compared the e92m to the C63 Sedan when the E90 sedan has been out the either time...and they is a good bit of weight difference in my E90 sunroof dct and the E92 carbon roof dct when it comes to weight and handling.

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by Properstyle

You all realize the base c63 has never been compared to the m3 right? Here some info the c63s vagrant has always been around it was referred to as the p30 and later p31 package and guess what, in a naturally aspirated motor it made more power than a base c63. And no one bat an eye at that. Oh well why is that because they had no idea the difference. Even now when a m3 owner pulls up to a c63 on the high way they have no clue there are 3 different versions of the coupe and the sedan and then the black series. So why are you crying now. Benz has always been the muscle car of the group while m diversion has always been lighter and more nimble. Holy crap

Base c63 w204 didn't come with a LSD it was a option to added, It didn't come with floatin rotors it was an option, it didn't come with forged internals that wa also an option to add and they fell under the 507 package or the P31 package which when ever a test drive wa done it was using the p30/p31 package car.

2015 m3 weight of 3,516 lb= 8.1lbs/hp

2015 C63S weight 3786lb= 7.5lbs/hp

Correct numbers taken from BMW and Benz not google. The c63 has a slight power advantge but as I've already stated this has been true since the c55 the benz has alway made more power than the m division in every model. Your more wrapped up in power numbers and not even the electrical diff that comes with the C63S lol...

Further more None of you complained when they compared the e92m to the C63 Sedan when the E90 sedan has been out the either time...and they is a good bit of weight difference in my E90 sunroof dct and the E92 carbon roof dct when it comes to weight and handling.

This is the last thing I'm going to post because clearly you still don't understand comparing cars to arrive at a meaningful conclusion (which some of us are arguing) vs. comparing cars at a certain price.

Forget about options because it seems to overcomplicate the simple fact that if I was in the market with a budget, would I buy a M3/M4 for $62k/64k or a C63 AMG for $62k? I'm not even looking at a C63S that cost $10,000 more. I don't care if the C63 doesn't come with stuff the M3 has and vice versa. Each company has their own idea what they think is a good package and what options are available. If the C63 AMG didn't have option X but the M3 did, I would want to know that and see how it affected the car to come to a conclusion that I could use.

What you and all all these reviews are saying is that for an additional $10k, you should be getting a faster, stronger and likely more capable C63. Well, no shit. You spent $10k more over a M3/M4 and the base C63 but I still don't know if a C63 is a good car. Does the C63 not match up well with the M3/M4 that I need to spend an additional $10k for the C63S?

[Properstyle]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

This is the last thing I'm going to post because clearly you still don't understand comparing cars to arrive at a meaningful conclusion (which some of us are arguing) vs. comparing cars at a certain price.

Forget about options because it seems to overcomplicate the simple fact that if I was in the market with a budget, would I buy a M3/M4 for $62k/64k or a C63 AMG for $62k? I'm not even looking at a C63S that cost $10,000 more. I don't care if the C63 doesn't come with stuff the M3 has and vice versa. Each company has their own idea what they think is a good package and what options are available. If the C63 AMG didn't have option X but the M3 did, I would want to know that and see how it affected the car to come to a conclusion that I could use.

What you and all all these reviews are saying is that for an additional $10k, you should be getting a faster, stronger and likely more capable C63. Well, no shit. You spent $10k more over a M3/M4 and the base C63 but I still don't know if a C63 is a good car. Does the C63 not match up well with the M3/M4 that I need to spend an additional $10k for the C63S?

I wasn't even talking about price My comments were toward this, You clearly seemed to be missing it.


"all reviews are comparing the C63 S to the M3.. they should compare the normal C63 to it untill a comp pack M3 is out.. "

They NEVER COMPARED A BASE C63 TO M3. every c63 that has ever been compared were c63s varants I wasn't looking at price as a BASE m3 isn't even being used and When you have 9k brakes being used on the m3s is price really even a mark to compare? If you use a m3 with the brake pakages that is damn near equal to the price of the c63S if you really want to argue price.
So if you want to make that comparision then the m3 also needs to be the complete based performance option model. (yet to be done).

[Year's_End]

Way too much over thinking going on with these badges. The C63 AMG "S" is simply the better performing version they offer; it's not some low volume spin-off like a Black Series, so of course you can compare it to an F80. 10k isn't a negligible amount at these price points, but it's hardly a class divider either. In an ideal world, these comparisons would use closely specced models for the sake of a fair test, but that's up to what the testers can get their hands on, or what the OEMs are willing to hand over.

The few pounds saved from the CF roof (marketing gimmick more than anything else, and I think you're bullshitting me if you can really notice the difference) isn't going to create a noticeable testing advantage, and those CC brakes aren't going to offer any legitimate performance testing benefits outside of repeated hotlaps. Some additional power will be useful, but it's not going to change the fundametal characteristics of the car. When these cars get paired up for a head-to-head, the intangibles and entire package will create a winner.

[AKG M3]

Is the C63 going to be built in Germany? I think the regular C Class is built in a new production facility in the States now.