[pz619]

Originally Posted by Sassicaia

There are always exceptions to every rule, but that only proves the rule is true.

Part of the reason you pay a premium for BMW is because its made in Germany. If they out sourced to China or this case Mexico I would expect the price to drop accordingly as I would see less overall value perceived or otherwise.

Drop the cost of a 3er BMW by 30% as a result of moving to mexico and maybe id consider it (actually I still wouldnt), but at least it wouldnt bother me.

No, I pay the premium because I want the end product. I don't care where it's made, especially if the specifications on the build/factory is the same. I'm looking at it like the apple's iphone. It's made in China, but I don't think anyone perceives the quality to less than a competing phone produced elsewhere. It certainly commands one of the higher prices and I doubt it could be built any better in the US or any other country for that matter.

On the flip side, are you telling me you would pay 30% more for your 3 series to built in Germany versus anywhere else? I'm just saying the value isn't there.

[amw896]

Originally Posted by pz619

No, I pay the premium because I want the end product. I don't care where it's made, especially if the specifications on the build/factory is the same. I'm looking at it like the apple's iphone. It's made in China, but I don't think anyone perceives the quality to less than a competing phone produced elsewhere. It certainly commands one of the higher prices and I doubt it could be built any better in the US or any other country for that matter.

On the flip side, are you telling me you would pay 30% more for your 3 series to built in Germany versus anywhere else? I'm just saying the value isn't there.

seriously comparing phone hardware to car hardware?

the reason apple can do this is because all phones are essentially the same hardware. Apple uses garbage hardware, installs restricted code, marks it up 750% and sell it to people with your logic.

[r3dbimmer89]

Originally Posted by amw896

seriously comparing phone hardware to car hardware?

the reason apple can do this is because all phones are essentially the same hardware. Apple uses garbage hardware, installs restricted code, marks it up 750% and sell it to people with your logic.

I think the OP was trying to say that hardware is designed by the manufacturer regardless of where the car is made.... technically an iPhone is a US designed and engineered product with production being in China to Apple's standards.

The same goes for the next gen 3er. It will be DESIGNED and ENGINEERED by BMW in Munich. It will still be a German car. Germans will train the Mexicans...Germans will probably even run the plant as in the case with VW and Audi in Puebla. I saw a documentary on the new Audi plant while I was in Mexico and even the higher ups who are Mexican spent months in Germany training and learned to speak German fluently. I'm sure it will be the same for BMW.... plus have any of you guys been to the Munich plant? If there is a bit of xenophobia....half the plant workers are TURKISH!

[bringonthenite]

Add my name to the list. I won't pay a premium for a German sedan made in Mexico. Hopefully Canada will still get German production if it is still available. I can't believe G20s would be built in Mexico and shipped to Germany.

[pz619]

Originally Posted by amw896

seriously comparing phone hardware to car hardware?

the reason apple can do this is because all phones are essentially the same hardware. Apple uses garbage hardware, installs restricted code, marks it up 750% and sell it to people with your logic.

I don't know how you got to that statement, but you missed the point. The physical phone wouldn't be any better if it was manufactured in Cupertino versus China.

You must like androids

[Bigiggs]

Originally Posted by Sassicaia

Haha. No chance. I would never pay the premium for a German car that's not made in Germany. Never.

Agree 100%
From a profit margin point of view BMW will be killing it, however I will not entertain this option. Thank you very much. If the next 3er does not have a German build option I will not be purchasing this line of cars.

[ynguldyn]

Currently, 320i, 330e and M340i xDrive are not on the list of Mexico plant models. On the other hand, German production is still possible for all U.S. bound G20 models.

This could change with time, of course.

[bringonthenite]

Originally Posted by ynguldyn

Currently, 320i, 330e and M340i xDrive are not on the list of Mexico plant models. On the other hand, German production is still possible for all U.S. bound G20 models.

This could change with time, of course.

If the M340i XDrive is not on the list then I am fine. Hopefully your news is correct.

[M3Fire]

Originally Posted by Jason

Attachment 1443084June 16, 2016

• Milestone for growth in NAFTA free-trade zone
• Production of BMW 3 Series Sedan from 2019
• Investment of one billion US dollars
• BMW Group Plant San Luis Potosí sets new sustainability standards
• San Luis Potosí / Munich- June 16, 2016... Today’s ground-breaking signals the start of construction of the new BMW Group plant in Mexico. Guests attending the official ceremony in San Luis Potosí included Rogelio Garza Garza, Undersecretary of Industry and Commerce at the Mexican Ministry of Economics; Dr. Juan Manuel Carreras López, Governor of the state of San Luis Potosí; Oliver Zipse, member of the Board of Management of BMW AG, responsible for Production and Milagros Caiña-Andree, member of the Board of Management of BMW AG, responsible for Human Resources and Labour Relations.

Newest BMW Group plant with cutting-edge technologies
Board of Management member for Production Oliver Zipse believes the new plant in San Luis Potosí will be a special location: “All of the BMW Group’s knowledge and capabilities will be on show at our new location in Mexico. The production system being established there will be a leader in productivity and sustainability, thanks to the use of innovative technologies. I am delighted to launch this ground-breaking BMW Group plant on its way.” Board of Management member for Human Resources Milagros Caiña-Andree underlined the BMW Group’s role as an employer: “Our success depends above all on the people who work for us. Their capabilities create our products. They form the strong foundation of our new BMW Plant San Luis Potosí. For this reason, it is also important for us to be an attractive employer here, to inspire passion for the BMW Group among employees, to encourage their ambition and develop their talents.” Governor Juan Manuel Carreras López commented: “The BMW Group is an important partner for our state and will help to further develop the industry in the region. San Luis Potosi is an attractive state for the automotive industry with skilled workers, a logistically interesting location and the necessary infrastructure for the development of this kind of projects. In San Luis Potosi, we are ready to support the industry.”

Start of production for BMW 3 Series Sedan planned for 2019
San Luis Potosí will build the BMW brand’s best-selling model series, the BMW 3 Series Sedan. For more than the 40 of the company’s 100 years, the iconic BMW 3 Series has been the heart of the brand and set the benchmark for dynamic performance, efficiency and design.

The plant in San Luis Potosí will also balance out production capacity at BMW Group Plant Rosslyn in South Africa, which will build the new BMW X3 instead of the BMW 3 Series in the future.

Start of production is scheduled for 2019, with an annual production capacity of up to 150,000 units. The BMW Group is investing around a billion US dollars in the new plant and creating at least 1,500 new jobs. The decision to locate in San Luis Potosí was based on criteria such as the broad supplier network and qualified local workforce, as well as the technical and social infrastructure.

Mexican plant to set new standards
The BMW Group Plant San Luis Potosí will be a full plant, comprising body shop, paint shop and assembly, characterised by an innovative production system and comprehensive sustainability standards. From the first full year of production, the plant will be the BMW Group’s most resource-efficient production location worldwide.

For example, the use of renewable energy sources ensures that the plant is supplied with 100% CO2-free electricity. Most of the electricity comes from a solar system on the plant’s grounds.

Responsible use of water resources is a particular sustainability goal in San Luis Potosí. The facility will have the lowest water consumption per vehicle produced in the production network. This will be the BMW Group’s first paint shop to produce zero process wastewater. The water needed for the painting process is reconditioned and recycled.

The BMW Group is relying exclusively on digital 3D plans for both building construction and equipment installation at the plant. During every phase of construction, architects enter specific information, such as location, dimensions or completion date into digital models. Digital 3D-scan technology is being used for the first time during the set-up phase. The combination of these two technologies enables real-time analysis of construction progress and cost-efficient modifications, and provides the BMW Group with constant planning reliability.

Plant will benefit from experience within the production network
Everything is in place for the start of production: 25 young mechatronics engineers began their training in September 2015. This year will see the launch in cooperation with local technical colleges of similar programmes for production mechanics and automotive mechatronics experts. Mexico has a work-linked training concept based on the German model.

The plant in San Luis Potosí will benefit from experience within the BMW Group production network. Plants Munich and Spartanburg are demonstrating their strengths by helping set up the Mexican facility. The Munich plant will serve as the lead plant for set-up and training, and will train more than 500 Mexican employees by 2019. “The training programme for future employees is an important cornerstone for us. The new plant will set international standards with innovative technologies and resource-saving production,” explained Hermann Bohrer, head of the BMW Group Plant San Luis Potosí.

BMW Group sets the course for continued growth in the NAFTA region
The BMW Group production network comprises 31 locations in 14 countries on four continents. The expansion of its international production network has always followed growth in markets around the world. In this way, the BMW Group ensures itself a highly-efficient and flexible international production network with a balanced distribution of value creation between Europe, Asia and the Americas. With this in mind, Mexico is another building block in the BMW Group’s growth strategy. The country is a member of the NAFTA free-trade zone with Canada and the US, and has concluded free-trade agreements with the European Union and MERCOSUR countries, making it easier to export automobiles and import supplier parts.

North America is one of the most important growth markets for the BMW Group. The company will invest a total of one billion US dollars in the expansion of its American plant in Spartanburg by the end of 2016 to achieve a production capacity of 450,000 units. The plant, which specialises in BMW X models, became the largest in the BMW Group production network in 2015. This expansion is in response to strong global demand for X models. The new BMW X7 will be produced in Spartanburg in the future. With Spartanburg and San Luis Potosí, the BMW Group will have full production capacities at key locations in North America.

The BMW Group in Mexico
The BMW Group has operated a local sales company in Mexico since 1994, and in 2015, sold a total of 17,475 vehicles (12,170 BMW, 5,305 MINI) – an increase of more than 17% over the previous year. Motorcycle sales for the same period reached 2,615 units (+15.2% YOY).

The BMW Group opened its Purchasing and Supplier Network Mexico in 2008. From here, the BMW Group maintains close relationships with its suppliers in Mexico and North and Central America. Last year, the BMW Group purchased products worth more than 2.5 billion US dollars from Mexican suppliers. This represents an increase of about 18% compared with the previous year. Over the long term, the Purchasing and Supplier Network Mexico will be managed out of in San Luis Potosí.

Attachment 1443084

Attachment 1443085

This may have been addressed, but it's a new Mexico plant instead of a New Mexico plant...

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by Bigiggs

Agree 100%
From a profit margin point of view BMW will be killing it, however I will not entertain this option. Thank you very much. If the next 3er does not have a German build option I will not be purchasing this line of cars.

Which brand would you go to?

[The J-Man]

Originally Posted by BMW M Power Mexico

As a Mexican who is proud of his country - even with all our very large problems - and working to do my part to improve it down here, I feel very sad about several of the very uninformed comments above and thankful for those who understand that this has no bearing on future BMW's quality.

I have to chip in. I had friends from our local BMW Club yesterday at that ceremony.

Please consider a few facts:

1. Mexico is a booming auto manufacturing hub. Audi, VW, Ford, FCA, Nissan, Honda, Toyota, Kia, Hyundai, GM, and Mercedes all have plants here.

2. We build close to 4M cars per year for world markets.

3. Quality is as good as anywhere. The exceptions have been limited to a specific manufacturer/plant (VW at Puebla for a while, now fixed) and have nothing to do with Mexico as a whole.

4. The plant here is better for the US than anywhere else in the world except for the US itself. Supply chains are very integrated due to NAFTA and tons of US suppliers will benefit from having the plant this close compared to anywhere else in the world except the US itself or Canada. Would you be complaining so hard about a new BMW plant anywhere else?

5. Mexico is not a dump. It is a middle-income country on its way to becoming a developed one. We are the 13th largest economy in the world. We have a huge corruption problem but there are millions of us here who are middle class and fighting to get that fixed every day.

6. Economic development here helps both the US and Mexico. It triggers more US exports here and diminishes the pressure for illegal immigration.

I hope that most BMW fans in the US will over time be able to approach this with an open mind.

Saludos desde México.

I am not worried about quality from Mexican plants, but I still would not buy a Mexican made BMW. Mexico is best known for burritos, Tecate, Tijuana donkey shows, piñatas, and cartel beheadings.

It would just feel wrong buying a finely engineered German vehicle that was produced in such a place.

Also, Mexico is not a middle income country. Mexico ranks somewhere around 67th in the world for per capita GDP, slightly ahead of countries such as Botswana and Turkmenistan.

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by The J-Man

I am not worried about quality from Mexican plants, but I still would not buy a Mexican made BMW. Mexico is best known for burritos, Tecate, Tijuana donkey shows, piñatas, and cartel beheadings.

It would just feel wrong buying a finely engineered German vehicle that was produced in such a place.

Also, Mexico is not a middle income country. Mexico ranks somewhere around 67th in the world for per capita GDP, slightly ahead of countries such as Botswana and Turkmenistan.

BMW Production Network by Country:

USA
Germany
Egypt
Italy
India
U.K.
Indonesia
Russia
Mexico
Austria
Malaysia
Brazil
Thailand
South Africa
China

So if party favors, sluts, assassinations, and delicious street food ruin the cache and quality of the car, everything should be built in Austria.

[PodDoc]

Originally Posted by hatepotholez

Good point on the Euro delivery. I am assuming no 3 series will have euro delivery? What about the next M3?

I think just like how the current 3 series is being made in germany and south africa, they will continue building the 3 series in germany along with mexico. So we will likely still be able to do euro delivery.

[SCOTT26]

We also build the 3er in Brazil,India and China and from kits in other facilities across the globe. Building the car in Mexico will be no different than building the car in Germany or elsewhere.
As the vehicle will have to conform to manufacturing and quality standards conceived and implemented in Germany.

South Africa and the Rosslyn plant is testament to that,otherwise they will not have been given the new X3.

[Zirenz2006]

Originally Posted by Mr.SugarSkulls

Lot of Trump supporters up in here...

What a stupid comment

[jmsent]

Originally Posted by lilmacarony

You do realize VW has been producing vehicles down in Puebla since 1964. It is the largest vehicle factory in North America and their biggest plant outside of Germany. All of the New Golfs, Wagens, Jettas and Beetles come from that factory. Has anyone compared the quality on a new Mk 7 Golf to an F30??? We are all BMW fans, but as fans, we can applaud the company for great engineering feats and some of the best driving cars, but we must also criticize the company as well. As far as BMW's go....initial quality on 3 Series built in South Africa actually ranks better than the ones built in Germany....And to get some 3 Series to the dealer quicker than South Africa? I am all for that. Plus tariffs and cost of production means they can add more standard features to the vehicles as well.

I've got a 2016 GTI, and as a past owner of 8 different BMW's I can only say that the build quality is at least as good if not better than any of those cars. The GTI was delivered to me with 0 flaws and has had no issues in the first 6 months of ownership. I can't remember any BMW I've had where I could say the same thing. Paint quality is also better than my E92 ever was, with fewer flaws and much less orange peel. Not something I expected, and quite an eye opener. BMW engineering is something to be admired, and the main reason why I stuck with the brand for so long. But build quality...not so much.

[Sassicaia]

Originally Posted by BMW M Power Mexico

As a Mexican who is proud of his country - even with all our very large problems - and working to do my part to improve it down here, I feel very sad about several of the very uninformed comments above and thankful for those who understand that this has no bearing on future BMW's quality.

I have to chip in. I had friends from our local BMW Club yesterday at that ceremony.

Please consider a few facts:

1. Mexico is a booming auto manufacturing hub. Audi, VW, Ford, FCA, Nissan, Honda, Toyota, Kia, Hyundai, GM, and Mercedes all have plants here.

2. We build close to 4M cars per year for world markets.

3. Quality is as good as anywhere. The exceptions have been limited to a specific manufacturer/plant (VW at Puebla for a while, now fixed) and have nothing to do with Mexico as a whole.

4. The plant here is better for the US than anywhere else in the world except for the US itself. Supply chains are very integrated due to NAFTA and tons of US suppliers will benefit from having the plant this close compared to anywhere else in the world except the US itself or Canada. Would you be complaining so hard about a new BMW plant anywhere else?

5. Mexico is not a dump. It is a middle-income country on its way to becoming a developed one. We are the 13th largest economy in the world. We have a huge corruption problem but there are millions of us here who are middle class and fighting to get that fixed every day.

6. Economic development here helps both the US and Mexico. It triggers more US exports here and diminishes the pressure for illegal immigration.

I hope that most BMW fans in the US will over time be able to approach this with an open mind.

Saludos desde México.

Mexico is not Germany when it comes to building cars. Would you drink German tequila?

Could Germany also outsource the designing of the engines, and designing of all future cars and expect the same quality?

[Sassicaia]

Originally Posted by pz619

No, I pay the premium because I want the end product. I don't care where it's made, especially if the specifications on the build/factory is the same. I'm looking at it like the apple's iphone. It's made in China, but I don't think anyone perceives the quality to less than a competing phone produced elsewhere. It certainly commands one of the higher prices and I doubt it could be built any better in the US or any other country for that matter.

On the flip side, are you telling me you would pay 30% more for your 3 series to built in Germany versus anywhere else? I'm just saying the value isn't there.

I already do pay the premium? We all do.

[Bigiggs]

Very simply, I would go to Porsche.

Scott will defend his corp's strategy (that is why he is employed by BMW) but at the end of the day I will vote with my wallet. I would never buy a premium car made in Mexico, Brazil, India, or China no matter how many QC measures are put in place. Its about heritage and history. Like someone else mentioned, would you buy German Tequila? Neither would I.

[Brasko]

Originally Posted by PawnStar

New Mexico, US would have been better.

Beat me to it!

[BimmerMat135]

If Bmw would give us a rebate for the money they are saving building un Mexico it could be interesting. But as usual this money will go to shareholders pockets. So there is absolutly no advantage for us to get a Mexican built car. Plus doing so you encourage cheap labor. At least when I bought my german built Bmw I knew that I've been helping someone to get a decent job with decent working condition.

[Mr.SugarSkulls]

Originally Posted by Zirenz2006

What a stupid comment

Oh no, you're hurting my feelings