[///M3Lover]

Originally Posted by smmmurf

Speed doesn't equate reliability. sometimes the most robust products are conceptually simpler

Toyota reliability is amazing. every single one my family or friends have owned has gone 100k, 200k+ without any issues

our bmw's on the other hand... 40 out of ordinary maint visits 745li, 10 dealer visits e38 740iL, several on the X5, a couple on the M3's... the simpler 6mt M3's have been the most reliable

I certainly hope BMW improves their reliability by collaborating with Toyota.
I am tired of fixing my E46 M3 every year. Love and hate the car at the same time.

[Beyu]

This is much better than the partnership between BMW and Hyundai.

Toyota already produces great luxury cars and have been making the Lexus lineup sportier over the years. They have a car to compete with the M3/C63, a supercar under their belt, and a concept car the LF-LC that is just downright gorgeous inside and out. Only good things can come from their collaboration.

[vladberca]

I think that we will have only good surprises in the near future due to this collaboration

For sure BMW has to extend its i Brand and Toyota has a good know how for hybrids, but also other sport models can be developed or even Lotus might be the next partner of this alliance

[cgaffney004]

Toyota reliability !?!? Lol. I work in Toyota service... Just as many issues as the next brand.. Don't be fooled.

[MisterSkiMask]

The joint venture product will be a disappointment, you can not create art by committee

[e46e92love]

I think this is awesome, in fact they may be on to something very big here. You see, if this works, they can expand this cooperation with other companies, then they all can eventually merge, and then consumers won't have the overwhelming job of choosing between car companies, there will only be one car company in the world, with 3 engines and 3 modular frames that are used to create 36 models....YES!!! All you will have to do is pick a color and the functionality you want, cause again, they will all drive exactly the same way!!!

This awesome!!!

Cheers,
e46e92

[Aries326]

Originally Posted by BMWPower06

Everyone mentions "Toyota reliability" but fails to realize the communications systems in a Camry are completely different than anything found in a BMW. BMWs use fiber optic bus systems, which are faster, but also more expensive and less reliable. BMW has no issues with engine reliability, it is their electronics. Seeing as how Toyota doesn't have anywhere near the advanced electronics that BMW does, I doubt they will be able to improve reliability...

No BMW engine problems? Tell that to S54 owners.

[jc05e46m3]

Originally Posted by Aries326

No BMW engine problems? Tell that to S54 owners.

When I had to have my VANOS replaced on my E46 M3 I wasn't too thrilled, I can tell you that. The S54 was a pain in the ass then it came to that. Not to mention having the shims during Inspection II

[Fraggy]

I find it saddeningly funny that so many people are okay with BMW advancing Toyota, a Japanese manufacturer who has done more to hurt American business than most any other car maker. In their heyday, the Japanese decimated the US auto industry, therefore hurting many many American families and lives. If BMW would have partnered up with Cadillac, to help build a super ATS sedan, I would be very excited about that as that would truly be a win-win for America and BMW.

[Cdnrockies]

Originally Posted by Fraggy

I find it saddeningly funny that so many people are okay with BMW advancing Toyota, a Japanese manufacturer who has done more to hurt American business than most any other car maker. In their heyday, the Japanese decimated the US auto industry, therefore hurting many many American families and lives. If BMW would have partnered up with Cadillac, to help build a super ATS sedan, I would be very excited about that as that would truly be a win-win for America and BMW.

Wut?

So you support a German company in America that has one plant in SC but not a Japanese one that is a major contributor to the North American economy? Racist/fanboi/FAIL much?

Toyota's thirteen North American manufacturing plants that make 11 Toyota and Lexus models have earned 11 segment awards out of a possible 19 in the 2008 J.D. Power and Associates Vehicle Dependability StudySM (VDS), more than any other manufacturer, for the third consecutive year.

Toyota directly employs over 43,000 in North America and its investment here is currently valued at more than $21 billion, including sales and manufacturing operations, research and development, financial services and design. Toyota's purchasing of parts, materials, goods and services from North American suppliers totals more than $30 billion per year.

[Enter Faster]

No manual transmission in M5's and now this.. Wow losing faith in humanity one post at a time

[BMW269]

Originally Posted by MisterSkiMask

The joint venture product will be a disappointment, you can not create art by committee

"Toyota GT86, built by passion, not by committee."


While at BMW M we have only committee with X5/X5 M, X6 M50d, M50d, M135i, and many other coming. No Z2, no M CSL.

[Tallest]

[QUOTE=tony20009;12240036]BMW engineering and Toyota reliability sounds like something I'd buy. !.[

Toyota reliability stems from toyota engineering. So bmw engineering might cancel it out. I rather think bmw driving and chassis component married to toyota engineering means we might have a nice outcome. Let toyota do mechanics and bmw sort out styling and driving. Id be happy. Bmw still uses some old tech in auxillary components that are silly. Cooling liquid box leaking anyone? 20yr old design, still cant get it right!

[JesterEXW]

I think this is a great combination. Some owners that are label whores may feel this cheapens the brand, but I disagree. A sign of a good company is when they are willing to admit that they can learn something from others. Toyota is a strong brand that has a lot to offer BMW, especially in the reliability category. This is the company that made the Supra too, so can't be all bad!

[bm3rmy]

Sorry, but what ''BMW fan'' means than?
Auto industry has become a whore. It is soon impossible to be a fan of new cars since different car manufacturers share same components.
how it will sound for ex from the point of view of a fan? ''I have a BMW 3 series and the best thing, it has a toyota engine''

[MisterSkiMask]

Originally Posted by bm3rmy

Sorry, but what ''BMW fan'' means than?
Auto industry has become a whore. It is soon impossible to be a fan of new cars since different car manufacturers share same components.
how it will sound for ex from the point of view of a fan? ''I have a BMW 3 series and the best thing, it has a toyota engine''

The auto industry is just trying to survive. Development costs are astronomical, margins are thin, and the market is super competitive, one miss (perhaps BMW 'i') can kill a company.

[BMW269]

Originally Posted by MisterSkiMask

The auto industry is just trying to survive. Development costs are astronomical, margins are thin, and the market is super competitive, one miss (perhaps BMW 'i') can kill a company.

+1

Originally Posted by bm3rmy

Sorry, but what ''BMW fan'' means than?
Auto industry has become a whore. It is soon impossible to be a fan of new cars since different car manufacturers share same components.
how it will sound for ex from the point of view of a fan? ''I have a BMW 3 series and the best thing, it has a toyota engine''

And who said BMW's would get Toyota engines ? On the otehr hand it would be nice if the M supercar got the LFA engine instead of their unresponsive low revving turbocharged engines.

[BLKBullet]

Some over the top reactions ITT to say the least. Take it easy, this isn't the end of the world.

[JB135MDCT]

First FWD, then the 2nd gen 1er and now turning Japanese. Fail, Fail, Fail, I really think so think so, so think.

[Fraggy]

Originally Posted by Cdnrockies

Wut?

So you support a German company in America that has one plant in SC but not a Japanese one that is a major contributor to the North American economy? Racist/fanboi/FAIL much?

Yes. American automakers do not directly compete with BMW, other than maybe Cadillac with the CTS V and the upcoming ATS.

But the Japanese directly targeted heart of the American auto industry, and in the process created ghost towns as American auto factories shut down.

So yea, I'm not real keen on doing anything that supports them, or being proud my car brand wants to help them get even better.

[IS3andME]

Originally Posted by Fraggy

I find it saddeningly funny that so many people are okay with BMW advancing Toyota, a Japanese manufacturer who has done more to hurt American business than most any other car maker. In their heyday, the Japanese decimated the US auto industry, therefore hurting many many American families and lives. If BMW would have partnered up with Cadillac, to help build a super ATS sedan, I would be very excited about that as that would truly be a win-win for America and BMW.

Tt was the US Big three that decimated themselves. They failed to act, they failed to adapt. I was reading an article in one of Motortrend's Classic magazines. They had an interview of a former Ford, and Chrysler exec, he said that Ford was given the idea of the Minivan, and whoever was head at the time axed it, he took the idea to Chrysler--the rest is history. Also, that the Finance guys (the bean counters) were the ones that were killing exciting cars...

The Big Three were late to the party when it came to fuel efficiency, and then when it came to the Lux market, they were pushing the Big Boats that The Baby Boomers loved----and which ended up killing Lincoln (they had a decent car in the LS and Mark VIII), and nearly killing off Caddy, until they came up with the CTS.

[mshab356]

Originally Posted by scflaw

They tried designing a GT-One replacement for the 24 hours of le mans with their many years of racing expertise... they didn't make it...

The Legend should have stayed home... its just making a fool out of itself.

The only way i can see them make another legendary sports car is to take the BMW I8 and rebadge it as a Prius R.