[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by floridaorange

i'm not arrogant enough to think the earth spinning on its axis perfectly distanced from the sun and all the incredible details of earth was designed merely on accident. But you are of course free to believe in nothing. It would exhaust me personally not to rely on the holy spirit. When you compare us human animals to all other animals i think you'll find we are children of god - divine beings.

I think it is all a bunch of make believe and nothing more than fairy tales but that's not really the point.

The question at hand is marriage and religion is probably a neutral bet, you can argue it helps people stay together and you can argue it traps people because the church says it's not right to separate or whatever. It's a non factor, suggesting the lack of faith is a driver of marriage disharmony is a long bow at best.

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by fiveohwblow

Now mine (opinion), why do atheists practice their religion of devout dissonance against those of faith? Aside from //melon that is. What are you looking to do, to what end? You proselytize worse than most of any faith and its disgusting.

1) I never brought up religion

2) We get bent out of shape pretty quickly because once you introduce religion you open pandora's box because there is no rational limit to religion. The entire premise is spirituality, divine intervention, "mysterious ways" , "has a plan for all of us" and basically shuts down pragmatism as you are not working within the constraints of reality anymore.

It's like trying to reason with the folks on the far left who just refuse to accept that government borrowing money has to end somewhere. They are adamant that governments have no real debt, as they can print money, once you set aside constraints, discussion becomes lost as the basic foundation and boundaries are gone.

[fiveohwblow]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

I think it is all a bunch of make believe and nothing more than fairy tales but that's not really the point.

The question at hand is marriage and religion is probably a neutral bet, you can argue it helps people stay together and you can argue it traps people because the church says it's not right to separate or whatever. It's a non factor, suggesting the lack of faith is a driver of marriage disharmony is a long bow at best.

I can agree with that. I have seen both sides of this argument for strengthening and division.

Bonus: Is it the religion, or those practicing?

Originally Posted by Alfisti

1) I never brought up religion

2) We get bent out of shape pretty quickly because once you introduce religion you open pandora's box because there is no rational limit to religion. The entire premise is spirituality, divine intervention, "mysterious ways" , "has a plan for all of us" and basically shuts down pragmatism as you are not working within the constraints of reality anymore.

It's like trying to reason with the folks on the far left who just refuse to accept that government borrowing money has to end somewhere. They are adamant that governments have no real debt, as they can print money, once you set aside constraints, discussion becomes lost as the basic foundation and boundaries are gone.

I can appreciate this perspective for sure and the analogy we can agree on. While religion as a whole has some out there concepts to believe, narratives seemingly contrived from thin air and places an infinite power in the hands of one or many deities.

I see many different religions having boundaries, rules, restrictions etc, but not all. When it pertains to marriage, I haven't found any text from my studies that show it advocates for the ruining, wrecking or damage to any marriage. While taken out of context many texts will have time specific rules, but that becomes an argument of intent which we cannot judge.

Lastly, I don't believe the intent of religion is to become irrational, rather, to explain what we cannot conceive thus giving way to the irrational with some explanations and directions. Perspective, and differences from others' is rather interesting!

[rcracin]

Originally Posted by fiveohwblow

Love is action plain and simple, expressed often as an emotion. Unless you've tangible evidence of its existence, its still theory. Have you hinged relationships on emotion alone and not even what you consider theory?

God's relevance, thankfully, isn't determined by your declarations regardless of how hard you opine. This is called opinion.

Now mine (opinion), why do atheists practice their religion of devout dissonance against those of faith? Aside from //melon that is. What are you looking to do, to what end? You proselytize worse than most of any faith and its disgusting.

It’s worth noting that god was mentioned first. You got called out on bringing up something imaginary. I don’t see where an atheist in this thread set out to denounce religion. Can’t denounce something that wasn’t first brought up.

[fiveohwblow]

Originally Posted by rcracin

It’s worth noting that god was mentioned first. You got called out on bringing up something imaginary. I don’t see where an atheist in this thread set out to denounce religion. Can’t denounce something that wasn’t first brought up.

I didn't bring it up, I merely responded such as yourself.

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by fiveohwblow

Lastly, I don't believe the intent of religion is to become irrational, rather, to explain what we cannot conceive thus giving way to the irrational with some explanations and directions. Perspective, and differences from others' is rather interesting!

Intent no, but it is irrational. It is called faith for a reason, you are asked to have faith because there's no rational evidence, if there was, it would not be called faith

In the context of the OP, I think it's irrelevant unless there is a conflict within the marriage re. incompatible religious beliefs. That's gonna cause issues though TBH my wife is a luke warm catholic and I was raised catholic (Croatian and Maltese respectively ) but I made it clear I will not get in the way of communion etc , I want zero to do with it other than the final ceremony and so far it has been pretty much a non issue.

[jeegunkim]

Reading through this thread is very depressing and discouraging - but i totally get it.

Oddly enough, I just got married last month - 11.11.20. We were engaged less than a month before we tied the knot via Zoom/City Hall.

I get that Covid has all of us going crazy, being locked inside with your significant other can be a dangerous thing but fortunately, I was shocked at how well my now wife and I were getting along since the lockdown and being stuck together. I think it actually helped improve our relationship and we grew even closer. I knew that if we can stick this out together, we can face anything. We are very untraditional and low key, I literally proposed in between work calls while she was just laying on the couch. We got married less than a month later via Zoom and have no plans to do a future reception or take a honeymoon (we actually travel a lot already, pre-Covid days). Now we are happier than ever and I feel very complete.

But I do agree with you all, everyone needs "me" time and it's only healthy for the relationship as long as both parties are emotionally stable enough with trust to give each other time and space when needed. Hope my experience makes some of you re-think your current predicament and to try and make things work but totally recognize that not everything is meant to last forever.

[Alfisti]

This guy, been married a month and wonders why it is easy. It's called the honeymoon phase for a reason

[Mintsopoulos]

My wife and I (just over 4 years/been together 8 years) have been living at her in-laws since Aug. 28th since we moved back to Chicago and will be moving into our new home on the 15th. If we can survive the next 14 days we can survive anything haha. Hell, with such a terrible year and everything that can go wrong going wrong I only see it making our relationship stronger.

[Alfisti]

Urrrrrrrgh we lived with her sister for 2 months through a reno and man, they dead set nearly killed each other. They are both super uptight, just brutal. Bro in law and I just stood back and ate popcorn watching it unfold.

[JP10]

Interesting read, I was supposed to tie the knot back in August, but covid pushed that to May. Been together maybe 9yrs now, so concerns are very minimal. In mind my were already married, been living together for 3 maybe 4yrs now. Bills are already combined an all that good stuff. Looking forward to getting that tax break finally lol!

In regards to religious aspect, I was raised catholic. Catholic school from K-8. With that said I'm not overly religious anymore. I acknowledge that he is present, but don't use it as a crutch. Fiance is Catholic as well, but same perspective as myself. Neighbors who are engaged offered to introduce us to their pastor and join a religious support group for engaged couples, but rejected that rather swiftly. To each their own though!

In regards to the divorce w/ kids aspect. My parents divorced when I was 8 or 9. Looking back I feel bad for my father. Mother was stay at home through us growing up, so 90%-95% of the time we were with her. Dad missed out on a lot, and being a kid you often don't want to hear advice from your parents. Funny how now being an adult I wish I had heeded some of his insight as well as given him more slack. Don't get me wrong, we have a great relationship now, but growing up it felt more like an obligation. If you want to maintain a rather proper connection with your kids then I would recommend toughing it out. First couple years of the divorce was hell, constant fighting, probably why I am emotionally dull on the inside haha.

[fiveohwblow]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

Intent no, but it is irrational. It is called faith for a reason, you are asked to have faith because there's no rational evidence, if there was, it would not be called faith

In the context of the OP, I think it's irrelevant unless there is a conflict within the marriage re. incompatible religious beliefs. That's gonna cause issues though TBH my wife is a luke warm catholic and I was raised catholic (Croatian and Maltese respectively ) but I made it clear I will not get in the way of communion etc , I want zero to do with it other than the final ceremony and so far it has been pretty much a non issue.

If deviation from intent, I’d blame humanity and not the faith. Your definition is yours to hold, but not one I subscribe to. I take the textual approach “ King James Bible -Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.”

As for the cause of divorce, it’s hardly irrelevant to the rest of the world. In fact, in one study 13% of marriages cited religious differences, or number 11 in terms of ranked reasons. While I am quite glad for you that you have worked it out, many others cannot. Faith is often tied to convictions, a step beyond most beliefs thus, tied to what is important to many at their core. I would argue atheism’s religion is of equal or greater importance, strictly from my observations.

[floridaorange]

The majority of divorces are from "irreconcilable" differences.

"I'm sorry, I was only thinking of myself" fixes that nonsense.

Having a loving father on earth makes it easier to conceptualize a loving heavenly father btw. Not having a father or loving father on earth makes it much harder to conceptualize a loving heavenly father.

Further, if you cannot find a church that is a good fit for you or your family, not going is likely better than going to a church that isn't a good fit. In our case, we go to a non-denominational church full of young families, so for us it's a great place to find community (common unity) with other families we otherwise would not know. The bible is full of wisdom, passed down from generations in my family. I have tried to turn away from it in my life in the past, that did not turn out so well. But others are free to do as they please, I'm just saying for me and my family, we will serve the Lord.

[Mintsopoulos]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

Urrrrrrrgh we lived with her sister for 2 months through a reno and man, they dead set nearly killed each other. They are both super uptight, just brutal. Bro in law and I just stood back and ate popcorn watching it unfold.

Sort of the same situation, She doesnt agree with her parents at all, for good reason, but shes just always at with them and being that she works from home full time she has no escape. Im hoping she can hold it together for 14 more days haha.

I knew it was going to be hard but damn I never knew it would be this hard. Its amazing to witness grown "senior" adults act like children. I will appreciate my own home like never before.

[Alfisti]

Ha! I have a deserved reputation for being short fused but I couldn't understand why they were bickering, it was sooooo sillly. To be fair tot he missus most of it was her sister just being an ass about stupid things like where the cutlery was put away. We're talking 4500 sq ft of living space for 2 families so we had a TON of space.

[wdb]

My father died about 6 weeks ago. He was married to my mother for 71 years.

They went through some stuff. Not that I can relate entirely but it isn't hard to imagine the Great Depression, WWII, two kids, two cancers, and too many heart stents to mention, perhaps being a wee tad more to bear than being stuck in the same house with the person you married for a few months.

My wife and I are doing okay. We're both on our second marriage, and so we have a preloaded ability to shrug stuff off. There have been moments. But I feel we're closer.

[floridaorange]

sound advice from my my best friends wedding

[W///]

This thread actually gave me a lot of comfort. While not in a marriage or anywhere as long term as some of the relationships as some, I got out of a 2 year relationship where it seemed like it was going somewhere. We moved in together probably too early, but COVID really hurt the relationship as she is a flight attendant. A lot of the same issues people listed, we went through as well.

At the end of the day though, 2020 has easily been one of the most informative years for me. I've always been bad at it, but I'm learning how to set boundaries, which is key to relationships. It's not enough to just hope things get better, and also you can't be the only one willing to work at it.

Bring on 2021.

[floridaorange]

the pandemic can certainly strain the finances depending on what industries the husband or wife are in - financial strain coupled with no quality time together is a recipe for problems. the key is being able to pivot, in a sense, and adapt to a new normal for an extended period of time, thus delaying gratification. some people i do believe are better suited for adapting to Rona environment - others not so much...

[Alfisti]

TBH I just think people want too much, and i'll cop it for this, but especially women. Men tend to accept the groove and routine of life, we tend to have more hobbies, women want excitement more often.

Finances are really tricky, my missus makes double what I do (we have always pooled all our money) but her spending far, far exceeds mine. It can be a prickly topic as she bristles when I try and reel her in but given our income we should be in a better place than we are.

[TomHudson]

My wife and I have been trying to quit smoking.
We agree to smoke only after sex...

I have a cigarette once a month;

She’s up to a pack a day...


RD...❤️

[floridaorange]

Originally Posted by Soul_Glo

Finances are a tough one. Not everyone is able to suss out how much debt their partner has when they get married. People mostly discuss bills and stuff when they live together. My wife had student loans, credit maxed out... We spent a good ten years of our marriage repairing her credit and paying things off. When she landed a job paying more than $150,000 a year it felt like we were going backwards as she wanted to buy things. That's been one of the ongoing challenges. Then when cancer developed her medical bills were killing me. I was working 4 jobs on a 7 day week to bring in more than $300,000 a year. We come from different families. Her old man lived for the day and used credit like no tomorrow. He's in his 80's with more than $60,000 in debts and still being chased by creditors. Mine on the opposite saved hard and worked hard. I didn't even know what debt or credit were until I got married. Thankfully there is an end in sight and she's making a good recovery. We had to temporarily move to the UK and give up our home in AZ so we could get the treatment she needed. Her debts became "our" debts. My dad always kept his accounts separate from my mom. My wife thinks I may as well not be with her if we don't have a joint account. Shit made me ill. I was out of work. Too stressed to work. Couldn't function. Couldn't even buy a loaf of bread. Thankfully one of her uncle knows a great financial expert. He educated my wife and she has been saving since. Often surprising me by paying $2000 into my checking account. It was a long hard road though and it nearly broke us. I didn't trust her with money but now I know if she uses it then it will be replaced with surplus.

amazing