[old grey steve]

Just awaiting 1 tool then chaps we're off....

[makkan00]

subscribed!

[1 AKY]

Any special prices for a guinea pig?

(and I can't find the post Steve, so just want to say that pray everything went well over the past few days)

[Ajs_435d]

Cool where are you located I could be up for this :thumbup:

[old grey steve]

Originally Posted by ajs_335d

Cool where are you located I could be up for this :thumbup:

Stevenage Herts

[Ajs_435d]

Hmm how far is that from Cumbria?

Could be very interested any idea on price? Pm me if you want?

Cheers

[woggledog]

Originally Posted by ajs_335d

Hmm how far is that from Cumbria?

Full details here: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=how+far+is+stevenage+from+cumbria

[Adam1712]

Good stuff Steve, another thing to add to my list!

[old grey steve]

Originally Posted by Adam1712

Good stuff Steve, another thing to add to my list!

indeed it doesn't stop does it

Originally Posted by woggledog

Full details here: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=how+far+is+stevenage+from+cumbria

Superb answer...

Originally Posted by ajs_335d

Hmm how far is that from Cumbria?

Could be very interested any idea on price? Pm me if you want?

Cheers

TBH the big thing with this is we actually don't have an answer as such at present, we knew where we were going with the patrols and what we estimated and what we are seeing are about right, this will be more involved it will require more time plus of course you've got to remove and replace the rocker cover gasket as well and clean inside the head as well due to the way it'll coke up. It's basically more involved....

If you haven't seen this from the states this will give you a fair idea what I'm raking about. http://www.e90post.com/forums/attach...0&d=1399666494

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by old grey steve

indeed it doesn't stop does it

Superb answer...

TBH the big thing with this is we actually don't have an answer as such at present, we knew where we were going with the patrols and what we estimated and what we are seeing are about right, this will be more involved it will require more time plus of course you've got to remove and replace the rocker cover gasket as well and clean inside the head as well due to the way it'll coke up. It's basically more involved....

If you haven't seen this from the states this will give you a fair idea what I'm raking about. http://www.e90post.com/forums/attach...0&d=1399666494

It seems 'involved'. Steve how do you compare this to
1) Hydro cleaning
and
2) Terra cleaning


I know that your walnut blasting is much more involved but what about the other two techniques which I have mentioned?

Thanks.

[old grey steve]

Originally Posted by makkan00

It seems 'involved'. Steve how do you compare this to
1) Hydro cleaning
and
2) Terra cleaning


I know that your walnut blasting is much more involved but what about the other two techniques which I have mentioned?

Thanks.

its more involved correct but it's old school tried tested and we see the results before our eyes using the blasting.

Re Terraclean and Hydrocleaning TBH I'm not the best one to ask. I've had a few customers who've had the Terraclean process done and they do report a difference to be fair but on cars like the Mini Cooper S and the 335i the biggest issue with this is Terraclean cleans where the fuel goes and as we know carbon builds up on the inlet valves where fuel no longer washes the back of the valves hence the Terraclean process on these cars will assist but on the intake valves of course it's game over. We looked at this back in late 2012 early 2013, you need 2 machines for for petrol and one for diesel, that's £7k plus VAT, plus the2 canisters (and you buy these in bulk)and they ain't cheap to huy in bulk either. Then you need to look at what you know v the stated claimed end results, we looked into this carefully for 2 months but opted to go the old fashioned more labour intensive route as its a result you can visibly see. As you're flushing 2 pressurised agent through the car using a machine how effective would it be on the cars we look after? Answer we were so sure. If we were looing after Fords and Vauxhalls maybe we'd of given it a go.

With the hydro cleaning this isn't new technology, from the limited knowledge I gave it involves vaporising carbon turning it in to gas or vapour by mixing small hydrogen particles with air, they attach to the carbon react and break it down. Also hydrogen won't promote corrosion within the engine when used as a cleaning agent. Question is will it be effective?

Both are as far as I'm concerned designed to brake down and eliminate carbon deposits, both methods clearly state this, from what we've seen the in the petrols, blasting them with such force takes some going it just doesn't disappear it requires real effort, therefore hows pushing pressurised material through the engine going to work in comparison? It in our opinion won't get the result we need. With diesels one things for sure, the carbon will be far more advanced and will require a lot more cleaning hence the various extra tools including the various scrapers(hooks)it's almost like a dentists set up, therefore if they are expecting a fight that involves this sort of manipulation will a chemical really be as effective. I think not.

Both setups record better fuel, lower emissions Terraclean(remember wheeler dealers vid with the XK8)so unless thst was puling the wool over everyone's eyes it's a product that works.

But for our cars as one or two people on here have recorded it's not all that it seems. Hence we stick with the walnut blasting technique

[old grey steve]

So we have all the tools.. first attempt on an old 320d head



circled are the area's we concentrate on(not the best pics mind but you'll get the idea. So pre in head



Pre inlet port



And post in head



post inlet port



the general end result is much like the petrols i.e. messy carbon mess to start with and a cleanish looking end result, downside far more lalour intensive, you spend far more time scrapping re blasting than you'd ever do on a petrol, the other ting noticed was the carbo seemed to lift easier than we'd though but wasn't as easily extracted as the petrols, therefore you've got to do more clearing up before moving on to the next one.

Time was obviosuly one our side as we could on this first attempt spin the head around at our leasure to get a decent angle but in the car well we can see its going to take time as I'd previosuly stated.

Re booking yes we are now able to take them. Time wise this will be a full 1 day job and I do mean full from 8.30 til 5pm+ but if this test head is anything to go by it'll be worth it from the first visual impression.

[gaza01]

Steve...what about a combination of the processes. Hydro or terra to start the cleaning and loosen stuff up then yr old fashioned method to do the final clean.

Just a thought mind...so if its dumb just ignore me! Lol

[old grey steve]

Originally Posted by gaza01

Steve...what about a combination of the processes. Hydro or terra to start the cleaning and loosen stuff up then yr old fashioned method to do the final clean.

Just a thought mind...so if its dumb just ignore me! Lol

its far from a dumb question Shaun, on the petrols we use in the finals stages TunAp 133 valve cleaner(not available to the General Public)which can be sprayed in to the ports as instructed and allowed to penetrate. We've used this on its own in the past and it's able to only make a small dent in removing carbon deposits(far from the actual stated data on the can.... but it does indeed help hence it gets used.... but we can do without it)

Diesels present different issues, the carbon is softer so from what we've initally seen breaks up differently, you can't use the valve cleaner used on a petrol in a diesel, there is the option of say using a diesel EGR intske cleaner(but until we are happy to use it and we'll use a donor head to verify)we'll stick to the method we were going to use(based on BMW's tech bulletin with regards cleaning these)

Using something like hydrogen may well assist thing is we're not without looking in to it going to invest in this sort of technology as it costs money to buy(and has to be run before the engine strip down takes place to enable us to blast the necessary intske ports)plus when you ready comments made in this forum it seems questionable as to whether it makes a dent in removing carbon. I honestly don't know all I know about it is what I've read on the net and on here. But if there's mileage in its use... Maybe something fur the future.

But a valid point made Shaun. Something for the back burner

[Digitalize]

I'd be interested in seeing what the final cost would be. I'm sure my 180k 320D could benefit from it.

[old grey steve]

Originally Posted by Digitalize

I'd be interested in seeing what the final cost would be. I'm sure my 180k 320D could benefit from it.

Any diesel will benefit, trouble is these tools have to fit and seat in their respective housings 100% with no leakage due to the high pressure of the blasting unit the risk of injury(think health/safety)is there therefore as the tools aren't designed for anything other than a BMW/Mini then you'd obviously need to have the manifold off a Mercedes to check but from memory they are a little wider/taller than the BMW's

[Digitalize]

My BMW 320D...

[old grey steve]

Originally Posted by Digitalize

My BMW 320D...

Where did I get Mercedes fromno I was asked a Mercedes question via PM from someone then jumped in here and answered yours.

We are going to sit down and work out where we stand re labour, with this test 320d head we've got to do a dummy run we believe we have used more product doing just one port and one internal appature than we sometimes use on one complete 335 application. Bare in mind this is the first diesel blast we've done once the heads completely clean more photos(I hope)will be taken, we will be able to work out prouduct used and approximation of time taken.

Bare in mind with diesels its inlet manifold off, rocker cover off(new gasket required)all injectors out which all adds to the time taken(one thing is for sure time wise this is a lot more involved both in time and of course labour than the petrols)