[nemo07]

Hi All,

I recently purchased the PTF Twin Disk Clutch and had it installed a couple days ago. This is the initial review of my experienced with the clutch since it was installed, 3 days ago.

First impressions of the PTF Twin Disk Clutch is that the clutch pedal is like stock feel. No noticeable chatter from the flywheel. I've only gotten about 180 km on the clutch so far. I'll be posting another review once I have broken it in.

Thanks,

[jayzF30]

Awesome! Looking forward to your post break-in. I am interested in going this route as well.

[3000GT MR]

My spec 3+ feels way better than this pos spec twin disc I run now. I beat the living crap out of the 3+ for over 20k miles at over 650+ and it never let up once. Engagement was smoother and the pedal was a bit harder but I still like it much better than the twin disk. Spec screwed up when they decided to use two 6 puck disks and one sprung hub. Non of that adds up and is a horrible pairing of components.
Basically I'd take my 3+over the twin disk, if I needed a twin disk I'd go with another brand that actually used full face disks.

[jippii ensio]

+1

If you search you will find a lot of unhappy customers with really bad experiences.

[jayzF30]

I just did and that's not true with the most recent reviews. They're all VERY positive. There was some throwout bearing issues that SPEC fixed for some people that had issues and since then its been nothing but positive.

[nemo07]

Originally Posted by jazze90

I just did and that's not true with the most recent reviews. They're all VERY positive. There was some throwout bearing issues that SPEC fixed for some people that had issues and since then its been nothing but positive.

+1

[3000GT MR]

I have the latest Rev. Obviously most people haven't had other clutches to compare it to. Anyone who says it feels like stock is lying. Stock clutch doesn't chatter on engagement because it's a full face not a puck. The twin disk originally had one full face and the people who got those and didn't have issues are lucky

[jacobniell]

Originally Posted by 3000GT MR

I have the latest Rev. Obviously most people haven't had other clutches to compare it to. Anyone who says it feels like stock is lying. Stock clutch doesn't chatter on engagement because it's a full face not a puck. The twin disk originally had one full face and the people who got those and didn't have issues are lucky

I do not understand this, because I have just spoken to Dzenno from PTF and he says that the clutch feels like stock (smooth engagement) when starting from zero? He also mentioned that the twin would chatter less then the single mass flywheel with SPEC3...?

I am in need of an upgrade as my dual mass flywheel with SPEC st2 is not holding up and generating faulty misfires, the knock sensors register the vibrations from the flywheel and think they are coming from the engine.

Any way, I am looking to get as much info before i decide to get either the SPEC3+ or the twin

[Torgus]

Every review I have seen says the twin has worse chatter than the stage 3+. I love my stage 3+. Easy to drive, firm pedal, holds my weak power, etc.

Mfactory is coming out with a twin disk. Let's hope it is better. Good news I think my stage 3+ will last me a long time.

I was always amazed how spec worked so well on this platform without problems etc. while on others you usually see a fair number of complaints etc. Well their twin disk did not help them.

The only attractive thing about the twin disk is the cheap rebuild cost. Stage 3+ still seems like the best option on the market unless you are going to be putting down 700 wtq. and going for HP that will make your engine pop.

[Torgus]

Originally Posted by jacobniell

I do not understand this, because I have just spoken to Dzenno from PTF and he says that the clutch feels like stock (smooth engagement) when starting from zero? He also mentioned that the twin would chatter less then the single mass flywheel with SPEC3...?

Remember he is trying to sell the product. Every review says the twin is louder chatter wise that I have read.

The stock clutch is almost too light. The stage 3+ feels perfect imo. I drive my e90 with the stock clutch and prefer the feel of the 3+ just not the engagement if I want it to be super smooth the stock clutch is easier. But pedal feel 3+ all the way.



Interesting 3kGT say the 3+ engagement was smoother. If my 3+ was much worse engagement wise it would be a pain as a daily I think.


I still find the PTF/Motiv this is an exclusive product you can only buy from us thing hilarious. Glad you can buy it from the manufacture now.

[3000GT MR]

I put over 20K hard miles on the 3+ and id take one over the twin disk any day. Does dzenno even own one or just drove a car once that had it or does he just work for a company that sells one. There is seriously no reason to have 2 6 puck disks in a twin set up and have one of those disks sprung. I'd love to see someone try and explain to me why 1 is sprung and the other isnt. Most people dont even know what the sprung hub is for. My opinion, Twin disk is junk. If you dont need 900lbs of holding force go with a 3+ or even 2+ or get rid of spec all together. I talk to 3 people on a regular basis that has the twin disk and im not the only one who feels this way.

BTW i have owned close to 10+ clutches on other cars and by far the best clutch ive ever had was a 3 disk carbon/carbon.

[proTUNING Freaks]

Appreciate the review nemo07. As for some of the comments, nemo07 had burned through his Stage 2+ SPEC clutch prior to getting this one so the experience is one after having both the OEM clutch and the SPEC Stage 2+ clutch which had the aluminum single mass flywheel on his car. Maybe he can post some of the photos of the 2+ disk he's shown us in an email prior to installing this clutch on his car.

This clutch was designed out of desperation for a clutch that'd be cheaper than the current options on the market while performing great on the road and the strip. We've personally driven the FX850 from Clutch Masters and it had terrible engagement and cost quite a bit more.

Considering the twin disk uses the same single mass steel flywheel as any other SPEC clutch and considering the noise is generated by the OEM gearbox internals and never the clutch kit components themselves, the noise you hear is not coming from the clutch kit, ever, on any car for that matter. Single mass flywheel simply exposes the gearbox noises that in this case BMW's conveniently masked with their OEM Dual Mass Flywheel design. Thanks Bavaria!

We have had nothing but positive reviews on it in the last while including some N55 guys that wanted a clutch for their Stage 2 upgraded cars that they're planning to be launching hard with out there. There have been issues in the past with the throwout bearing setting and some redesign on the clutch components themselves for clearance but all of that is in the past.

As for the triple carbon clutches, we have a 997.1 turbo at the shop with an ERP Triple Carbon and I would dare you to try driving it, and ERP clutches are built by RPS! And its 4500 USD retail.

[Torgus]

I want to hear more about there being no chatter.

[proTUNING Freaks]

Originally Posted by Torgus

I want to hear more about there being no chatter.

This clutch will absolutely expose gearbox noise. We have never said there will be no chatter that'd be absurd.

What we have gathered on our test car as well as from customers running it along with experience with the 2+ and 3+ SPEC clutches on our cars with single mass flywheels is chatter is similar and on some cars does get quieter than before.

One of the reasons going with thicker gearbox oil helps chatter in the first place is because that's exactly where your noise is coming from. Thicker oil makes it harder for internals/gears to be banging around and mutes the noises. UUC has a great article on their website about a "cocktail" they use in E36/E46 gearboxes to help with chatter.

Simple concept and often confused for single mass flywheel/clutch kit making the noise. Hope that clarifies some of the confusion here. As for the OP his experience is directly related to having the Spec 2+ and their single mass aluminum clutch prior to this one.

We'll hopefully hear back once the clutch is broken if they find the time to update this thread. Last we heard is they were having a blast and really loved everything about it so far.

Lastly, if you can't stand any noise with a manual transmission at all but are looking to make some crazy torque numbers then this isn't either the clutch for you or the right transmission. Also, leave the OEM tranny mounts in place or there will be more noise!

Single mass flywheel is a requirement with the N54 manual cars usually past 450-500wtq as the OEM dual mass starts to vibrate and set of false misfires and many have been there before with those. Troubleshooting that issue can/does get nasty.

[The Convert]

I have a PTF twin disc that had the rear disc, intermediate disc and pressure plate replaced by Spec due to their "recall" and I can honestly say that I do not enjoy driving the car anymore for regular driving. The only time I enjoy the car anymore is if I specifically take the car out for a drive and then it's mostly because I am constantly moving. The twin disc in stop and go traffic or from a stop on any incline at all is terrible. It shudders like crazy and is not at all smooth engagement wise since you can't really slip it like you can a full face disc. That's my .02

[3000GT MR]

The Chatter i speak upon is during clutch engagement. The OP is going from an aluminum to a steel FW so yeah im sure the car feels a million times better. Aluminum should never had been an option for this or any turbo car.

[3000GT MR]

Originally Posted by The Convert

I have a PTF twin disc that had the rear disc, intermediate disc and pressure plate replaced by Spec due to their "recall" and I can honestly say that I do not enjoy driving the car anymore for regular driving. The only time I enjoy the car anymore is if I specifically take the car out for a drive and then it's mostly because I am constantly moving. The twin disc in stop and go traffic or from a stop on any incline at all is terrible. It shudders like crazy and is not at all smooth engagement wise since you can't really slip it like you can a full face disc. That's my .02

Exactly. you beat me by a minute

[proTUNING Freaks]

The Convert, that's the case because of your SINGLE mass flywheel. It'll be the case with ANY aftermarket clutch with a single mass flywheel, period. We know because we ran and still run the 2+ and 3+ as well as ACT single disks in the past with single mass flywheels. You'd only be truly happy with a dual mass flywheel but that wouldn't fly given your power goals/needs.

3000GT MR, agreed. We don't recommend the aluminum to anyone and we don't run it on any of our cars either. The higher weight of the steel flywheel is better for the street and for launches it better stands up to heat and less prone to welding than aluminum especially given material in the twin disk is less prone to welding than the 3+ you had.

[Carl Morris]

OP, just understand that two different definitions of chatter are being used in this conversation. At least one poster means the way the the clutch engages (smooth versus jerky oscillation because of the hub springs) and at least one poster means gear chatter when the car is running in neutral with the clutch out. Be sure you know which definition is being used before drawing any conclusions about "chatter".

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by proTUNING Freaks

Appreciate the review nemo07. As for some of the comments, nemo07 had burned through his Stage 2+ SPEC clutch prior to getting this one so the experience is one after having both the OEM clutch and the SPEC Stage 2+ clutch which had the aluminum single mass flywheel on his car. Maybe he can post some of the photos of the 2+ disk he's shown us in an email prior to installing this clutch on his car.

This clutch was designed out of desperation for a clutch that'd be cheaper than the current options on the market while performing great on the road and the strip. We've personally driven the FX850 from Clutch Masters and it had terrible engagement and cost quite a bit more.

Considering the twin disk uses the same single mass steel flywheel as any other SPEC clutch and considering the noise is generated by the OEM gearbox internals and never the clutch kit components themselves, the noise you hear is not coming from the clutch kit, ever, on any car for that matter. Single mass flywheel simply exposes the gearbox noises that in this case BMW's conveniently masked with their OEM Dual Mass Flywheel design. Thanks Bavaria!

We have had nothing but positive reviews on it in the last while including some N55 guys that wanted a clutch for their Stage 2 upgraded cars that they're planning to be launching hard with out there. There have been issues in the past with the throwout bearing setting and some redesign on the clutch components themselves for clearance but all of that is in the past.

As for the triple carbon clutches, we have a 997.1 turbo at the shop with an ERP Triple Carbon and I would dare you to try driving it, and ERP clutches are built by RPS! And its 4500 USD retail.

It's probably worth noting that Spec Aluminum Flywheel will chatter more then the Steel.

Originally Posted by Carl Morris

OP, just understand that two different definitions of chatter are being used in this conversation. At least one poster means the way the the clutch engages (smooth versus jerky oscillation because of the hub springs) and at least one poster means gear chatter when the car is running in neutral with the clutch out. Be sure you know which definition is being used before drawing any conclusions about "chatter".

This is an excellent point as there are two types of chatter.

Audible and mechanical.

The problem with the SMFW is audible chatter and not so much the mechanical chatter as the latter comes primarily from the clutch.

Originally Posted by 3000GT MR

The Chatter i speak upon is during clutch engagement. The OP is going from an aluminum to a steel FW so yeah im sure the car feels a million times better. Aluminum should never had been an option for this or any turbo car.

+1

[Torgus]

Good to hear the twin disk is not recommended for a daily. This should be explained on websites selling it Etc. If it really is that much worse than the 3+ that is, which it sounds lIke that is the case. Has there been any documented 3+ giving away or not able to handle the tq? If so I almost wonder if the higher spec clutches would be a better option than the twin. I recall someone with the 5 saying it wasn't so bad but I was skeptical.

[Torgus]

As far as flywheel weight I would be happy to run a heavier one if it had less chatter. I don't need a lw flywheel to rev faster. My understanding is the dual mass threw codes because of its design. I'd be fine with a heavier one as it should make it easier to drive, less chatter, etc.