[YRAGAEL]

Hey guys. I was concerned about high oil temps (240-250 just seems too damn high) so I installed a BMS diverter valve. On a recent trip to Las Vegas, outside air temps were around 40-50˚F and with the oil constantly flowing through the cooler, my oil temps got pretty low, around 170˚ sometimes (downhill), cruising at around 2800 RPM / 80 mph on the freeway.

Now I'm concerned that these oil temps are too low. Any thoughts?

[remixsecret]

I think anything above the 1/4 mark on your oil gauge is optimum.

[C ///M]

Terry makes great stuff, but his oil cooler "thermostat replacement" should be for track cars only. I think it's a terrible part for daily drivers especially in climates with freezing temps. The oil cooler shouldn't be operating at all times for best efficiency.

You should have gone for Andy Divers thermostat. I forget the exact temp, but it opens at like 180 or 190 I think (stock is something crazy high like 250 or maybe 235, I forget). Optimum oil temp is 212-220.

P.S. 170 is much too low in my opinion. Needs to be 212-220 (water boils at 212 at sea level).

[YRAGAEL]

Around town my oil temps are always good - usually 220-230, so the bypass is a benefit for that situation (I'm in SoCal so temps are usually on the warm side year round). It's only freeway cruising with cooler outside air temps that causes the oil temps to dip below 200.

Is there a spring available for the stock oil cooler thermostat that opens the valve at a lower temp? Stock opens at 240 - crazy high! I can't find any info on Andy Divers except on Facebook - hit him up there?

[C ///M]

Originally Posted by YRAGAEL

Around town my oil temps are always good - usually 220-230, so the bypass is a benefit for that situation (I'm in SoCal so temps are usually on the warm side year round). It's only freeway cruising with cooler outside air temps that causes the oil temps to dip below 200.

Is there a spring available for the stock oil cooler thermostat that opens the valve at a lower temp? Stock opens at 240 - crazy high! I can't find any info on Andy Divers except on Facebook - hit him up there?

Andy's is an actual lower temp thermostat, so it comes with the lower temp spring:

http://www.ad-eng.net/store/p19/BMW_...hermostat.html

Edit: considering you're in SoCal, you can probably get by on the bypass, but I think the lower temp t-stat will be perfect for you. I'm in Chicago, so I don't know exactly what kind of year round temps you get. We can't have the oil cooler running at all times here. The car will never reach operating temps during daily winter use.

[N54Society]

Originally Posted by C ///M

Andy's is an actual lower temp thermostat, so it comes with the lower temp spring:

http://www.ad-eng.net/store/p19/BMW_...hermostat.html

Edit: considering you're in SoCal, you can probably get by on the bypass, but I think the lower temp t-stat will be perfect for you. I'm in Chicago, so I don't know exactly what kind of year round temps you get. We can't have the oil cooler running at all times here. The car will never reach operating temps during daily winter use.

So the oil cooler has a thermostat just like the coolant thermostat? This part replaces the stock oil cooler thermostat? Did I get all that right? Thanks

[Lambobimmer]

That is a mod that you should really remove in the colder months and put the stock thermostat back in. That is what I do and it works great. I actually just took my BMS thermostat out this week.

[vtl]

Can't seem to find any technical information on the AD engineering thermostat.

So it looks like has more parts than just the BMS bypass. Is this an actual thermostat that opens at a lower temperature? If so what is the temperature?

http://www.ad-eng.net/store/p19/BMW_...hermostat.html

Has no other technical information I can see on the website

[The Ghost]

Originally Posted by YRAGAEL

Hey guys. I was concerned about high oil temps (240-250 just seems too damn high) so I installed a BMS diverter valve. On a recent trip to Las Vegas, outside air temps were around 40-50˚F and with the oil constantly flowing through the cooler, my oil temps got pretty low, around 170˚ sometimes (downhill), cruising at around 2800 RPM / 80 mph on the freeway.

Now I'm concerned that these oil temps are too low. Any thoughts?

I run it and it is fine for me in the winter. My oil temps stay above 190 which is perfect for me. If I'm on it hard, it certainly gets into the 220-230F range. When it is warm outside, this is needed, otherwise my car gets to and wants to go above 250F when going WOT.

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by YRAGAEL

Hey guys. I was concerned about high oil temps (240-250 just seems too damn high) so I installed a BMS diverter valve. On a recent trip to Las Vegas, outside air temps were around 40-50˚F and with the oil constantly flowing through the cooler, my oil temps got pretty low, around 170˚ sometimes (downhill), cruising at around 2800 RPM / 80 mph on the freeway.

Now I'm concerned that these oil temps are too low. Any thoughts?

170 isnt low. It's actually a perfect operating temp for oil. However, if you find yourself in sub zero temps and not breaking 160 ever that would be an indication that the thermostat delete should be removed. It's not designed for sub zero temps.

[C ///M]

Originally Posted by Jeff@TopGearSolutions

170 isnt low. It's actually a perfect operating temp for oil. However, if you find yourself in sub zero temps and not breaking 160 ever that would be an indication that the thermostat delete should be removed. It's not designed for sub zero temps.

Everything I've ever read over the past 20 years has said that 190 is the absolute bare-minimum for anything beyond the warmup period. As most probably know, the majority of internal wear and tear happens during start-up due to poorer lubrication. Running at 170 for any extended use is going to cause increased wear on some internals components, especially at higher rpms. Additionally, water vapor and any impurities aren't going to burn off under ~212° F, unless you're at higher altitudes.

Don't get me wrong, I like all of Terry's products, but something like this has a specific use. For most of the country that gets fluctuationing temperatures, it's just not a good part, unless you want to be swapping it in and out. That's why I like Andy's solution much better, best of both worlds (and he charges less for it). N54's should have come with a lower temp oil cooler thermostat from the factory, but you know how crazy BMW has gotten with efficiencies and emissions.

Why not try to get [mention]andy_divers[/mention] opinion on it. Dude is awesome and knows his stuff.

Edit: how do you mention people on this forum?

[YRAGAEL]

Thanks guys. It sounds like the AD Engineering thermostat would be a good 'medium' between stock and the 'fully open' BMS diverter. Does anyone know what temp it is set to open at? Not sure why they don't list this info as it's the one question literally everyone would have about it!

Jeff thanks for the reassurance about my low oil temp concerns. I was afraid at 170 the oil might be too thick to flow as it should and put added stress on the pump and cooler. Oil temp paranoia!

C///M just saw your post. I was also always under the impression that oil should be in the 200˚ range, but I am certainly no expert. I believe you are correct that BMW chose to run this engine so damn hot for emissions/mileage reasons.

[N54Society]

Man this is exactly what I need to control my temps! I can't believe more SoCal people don't use this part. This past Summer brought some brutal temps. I just ordered Andy's. Is he on these forums? I would like to know what temperature his opens up at too.

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by C ///M

Everything I've ever read over the past 20 years has said that 190 is the absolute bare-minimum for anything beyond the warmup period. As most probably know, the majority of internal wear and tear happens during start-up due to poorer lubrication. Running at 170 for any extended use is going to cause increased wear on some internals components, especially at higher rpms. Additionally, water vapor and any impurities aren't going to burn off under ~212° F, unless you're at higher altitudes.

Don't get me wrong, I like all of Terry's products, but something like this has a specific use. For most of the country that gets fluctuationing temperatures, it's just not a good part, unless you want to be swapping it in and out. That's why I like Andy's solution much better, best of both worlds (and he charges less for it). N54's should have come with a lower temp oil cooler thermostat from the factory, but you know how crazy BMW has gotten with efficiencies and emissions.

Why not try to get [mention]andy_divers[/mention] opinion on it. Dude is awesome and knows his stuff.

Edit: how do you mention people on this forum?

That's an interesting read you've found. Did you know most vehicles on the road today don't even get near 170F at full operating temp?

Oil viscosity is not any differnet at 150-170-190.

For example my corvette never exceeds 170F ever on a day to day basis, even in summer heat. Only during an endurance run over 7 minutes above 120MPH with bursts to 170MPH did it near 195F oil then it quickly cooled itself well below 170 again. So I guess my engine is full of water and just wearing itself to pieces? I don't think so

I'm all for looking over scientific data if you have any.

[135Pats]

170-200 is pretty standard operating procedure for most motors; the 54/55 series of motors run unusually hot. The 'exact' oil temperature for optimal use is unknown if we're being honest, clearly BMWAG felt 240-260 was just fine (which seems unlikely).

Think it's just important to properly define what the BMS unit is. It's not a thermostat, it's a thermostat delete. It removes the spring all together; oil is flowing through the cooler whether it's 20 degrees or 200 degrees.

Andy's unit is a modified thermostat which opens at a lower temperature than the OE unit. It functions identically to the factory design, but introduces oil into the cooler at a lower temperature.

[2010MSPORT335i]

So does anyone have any factual information or real world experience with Andy's?

I have the BMS delete and live in Florida, but during the winter months I feel that it takes a little too long to warm up.

[135Pats]

Originally Posted by idk alex

So does anyone have any factual information or real world experience with Andy's?

I have the BMS delete and live in Florida, but during the winter months I feel that it takes a little too long to warm up.

Yes. I've used his for a few months now. Didn't see oil temps exceed 230-240 under hard driving over the Summer.

Motor reaches what i'd consider a safe temperature (180-190) for normal driving in the same amount of time as with the factory thermostat.

Until you exceed the temperature at which AD's thermostat opens, the car functions and warms up 100% identically to stock.

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by 135Pats

170-200 is pretty standard operating procedure for most motors; the 54/55 series of motors run unusually hot. The 'exact' oil temperature for optimal use is unknown if we're being honest, clearly BMWAG felt 240-260 was just fine (which seems unlikely).

Think it's just important to properly define what the BMS unit is. It's not a thermostat, it's a thermostat delete. It removes the spring all together; oil is flowing through the cooler whether it's 20 degrees or 200 degrees.

Andy's unit is a modified thermostat which opens at a lower temperature than the OE unit. It functions identically to the factory design, but introduces oil into the cooler at a lower temperature.

To add, most super cars don't exceed 210F during endurance runs. Only BMW seems to think it's necessary to go as much as 250F. Those temps usually are near the sheer point of most oils too.

IIRC most of these high running temps were simply for emissions purposes and reducing pumping losses.

My point about cars rarely getting to 170F daily is true. The average Joe daily driving to work does not get enough heat in the motor to get oil to those temps. Of course many other factors will fall into play, engine size, N/A or Turbo, ambient temps ETC

We also have a Porsche 911 Carrera 4s in the family and the only person to actually get that car to full operating oil temp was me after beating the snot out of it for 30 minutes. That temp was also 210. My mother who primarily drives it barely got it into the 150F range.

I agree it's a moot subject on the thermostat delete. If you're in cooler temps simply remove it if you are worried. The modification was technically for "Race Applications" anyway.

I'm not going to deny it's not good to get your oil temps up to temp, I'm a true advocate of waiting for oil to warm up but the difference between 170-190 is extremely negligible.

[AirAndre335i]

This seems like something i need!!!

My n54 gets extremely hot in heavy traffic. I feel my cars performance suffer too.

Is there anything for us pre 03/2007 owners which operate in the same way andys does?

[theweebabySeamus]

Originally Posted by Jeff@TopGearSolutions

To add, most super cars don't exceed 210F during endurance runs. Only BMW seems to think it's necessary to go as much as 250F. Those temps usually are near the sheer point of most oils too.

IIRC most of these high running temps were simply for emissions purposes and reducing pumping losses.

My point about cars rarely getting to 170F daily is true. The average Joe daily driving to work does not get enough heat in the motor to get oil to those temps. Of course many other factors will fall into play, engine size, N/A or Turbo, ambient temps ETC

We also have a Porsche 911 Carrera 4s in the family and the only person to actually get that car to full operating oil temp was me after beating the snot out of it for 30 minutes. That temp was also 210. My mother who primarily drives it barely got it into the 150F range.

I agree it's a moot subject on the thermostat delete. If you're in cooler temps simply remove it if you are worried. The modification was technically for "Race Applications" anyway.

I'm not going to deny it's not good to get your oil temps up to temp, I'm a true advocate of waiting for oil to warm up but the difference between 170-190 is extremely negligible.

I've never understood the 'need' for these cars to have oil temps so high either, outside possibly emissions, which would be questionable anyways imo. I'd never heard of anything close to these temps before I got one of these cars. Almost seems like a bandaid for another issue, since as you stated a lot of oils wouldn't handle these temps well in the first place.

In addition, its not like everybodies running 20w50 in these engines.

[theweebabySeamus]

I'd be curious to hear Terry weigh-in on oil temp viscosities as I'm sure he wasn't throwing darts at random temps when he set the jb4 to turn on at 160.

[noorj]

If you're never getting the oil over 190F when you drive it, I sure hope you change the oil very frequently. Getting it past 90 C is essential in getting the fuel out of the oil, which is something that inherently occurs when you cold start a DI engine.