08-31-2019, 04:13 PM | #1 |
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Joe Achilles X3M review, mentions lack of low end torque
Just like a few members findings who have driven one he talks about the lack of torque at the bottom end which I found most interesting
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SCOTT26 "So as an admirer of the M5 and a potential customer of an M5 Touring. I would run naked around the streets of Garching if they were to offer one."
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08-31-2019, 07:52 PM | #5 |
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That is spooling up against the torque converter isn't it? I have seen your boost logs and replied to one of your threads, I'd love to see it going to wide open throttle from 2000rpm in a gear to see how it spools.
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SCOTT26 "So as an admirer of the M5 and a potential customer of an M5 Touring. I would run naked around the streets of Garching if they were to offer one."
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08-31-2019, 08:17 PM | #6 |
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A useful analysis of the car's every day usability. His impressions are consistent with my limited test drive.
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08-31-2019, 09:39 PM | #7 |
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I'll get you that specific log. If you look at this log it is close to what you want. There is no converter flash as it was a rolling test. Start at 2000 rpm and the boost and compare it upward...
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09-01-2019, 12:38 AM | #8 |
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Every engine has strenghts and weaknesses.
The S58 has a single minded focus on emotion and responsiveness. Anyone who values max torque availability at 1,300-1,500rpm is better off buying an M40i or the up and coming X5M.
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09-01-2019, 03:05 AM | #12 |
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He said he has it in comfort all the time... he was just pointing out how this car would do in the UK (so we now know the adaptive suspension is useless even in comfort for that market) ... and believe me it's bumpy 90% of the time outside motorways .
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09-01-2019, 03:42 AM | #13 | |
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Quote:
It's so much a sports car setup it makes it inadequate as a daily almost. |
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09-01-2019, 04:30 AM | #14 |
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I was thinking the same thing myself. That would be like putting in in Comfort, tracking it, then complaining about excessive body roll in the corners. If he had taken a few minutes to RTFM, he'd have seen that sport plus was only intended for the very smoothest of tracks. I'm pretty new to the forum here but am beginning to see why so many groan every time this guy does a "review".
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09-01-2019, 08:21 AM | #16 |
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Drives: BMW X3M Comp
Join Date: May 2013
Location: London
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Those roads were bad...and by no means a true representation of UK roads. If you live in the countryside the roads are narrow and bumpy...and yes there's lots of country roads in the UK, but about 1% of the UK population live and use them regularly.
In that scenario they buy something more suitable. Joe drives his M2 Comp on those roads, I expect that's where he got the pillow idea... |
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09-01-2019, 03:22 PM | #18 |
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Joe and i filmed the "part 2" video this morning, so that should be up in about 7 to 10 days.
My MY19 X3 M40i shows the strengths and weaknesses of the X3M quite well i think. The X3M is impressive, and would be a great drive in the right circumstances, but i'm not sure that's in the UK. German roads are wonderful, and i'm sure the X3M works brilliantly in that environment. And my experience of Swedish roads suggests you'll be just fine too.
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09-01-2019, 04:09 PM | #19 |
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A rather puzzling review and must admit, hard to watch all the way through.
Pointless to place in Sport+ and run that narrow rough road. BMW's M Engineering team have indicated the road conditions in which that setting should be used, so why even show that? And I must be missing something here about the low-end torque issue. If I'm using manual paddle shifting, I have enough knowledge of conditions that if I need instant acceleration at any speed, and with my hands in proper steering wheel placement, I instantly downshift to obtain maximum torque. If I'm in auto then my experience with BMW's transmission has been smooth and quick downshifting to proper torque range (in high- and mid-range speed conditions). So an honest question - why is the focus on a specific gear acceleration relevant to my real world driving? Why should I care if it has to downshift (which it has done many years, in many situations, and performed flawlessly)? |
09-01-2019, 10:24 PM | #20 |
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He's complaining about 1200-1500 rpm torque issues? Yeah maybe it lacks torque below 2k rpms but if I'm looking for torque I don't really expect it in that range. Just shift. But if the power doesn't really start to build prior to 3k rpms then we've got a slight problem.
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09-02-2019, 12:14 AM | #21 | |
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In an A45 which I drive quite a bit it is at the same RPM in 7th at the same speed (maybe plus or minus 50rpm) and to achieve the same acceleration at motorway speeds I need to drop to 5th gear. Obviously one of these cars is a 2 litre and the other is a 4.4 litre but I'm hoping the X3M isn't like the A45. I might get to drive an X3M in the next few days as one has arrived in the country now so it will be interesting to compare and contrast a 3 litre heavily turboed car.
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SCOTT26 "So as an admirer of the M5 and a potential customer of an M5 Touring. I would run naked around the streets of Garching if they were to offer one."
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09-02-2019, 01:34 AM | #22 | |
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Quote:
This engine kicks serious butt above 3K--I can deal with downshifting from time to time to get there. If you are worried about 0-60 time, well, that's what launch control is for. That's not really my main concern in a vehicle, but to each his own. Not saying this car can't get off the line, however. Guys around town are crying as they watch an X3 smoke them LOL. RE: low end torque, it does feel a little lagging below 3K, but honestly, coming from a 2018 M4Comp, I prefer the power curve on this car. You can troll around town in efficient throttle, and if you keep it under 3K, things are very chill (with a nice exhaust note). The M4C/S55 was sweet, but not as easy revving as this engine, and overall more twitchy in city driving. Over 3K the S58, especially in Sport/Sport+ on the throttle, absolutely kills it. I think they deleted the interior audio engine racket in the X3M, but even so, the S58 has an ease about it and sound that is infectious and makes you want to rip on the thing endlessly. It just sings. I literally have to tell myself when I get into the car, "this is an under 3K drive" or else I end up going crazy on the throttle. Its such an easy revving engine that sounds so amazing, you can't help but want to wail on it. For the typical day to day driver, the xDrive setup on this car is also way better than the M4. Yes, on a track or going balls out on the right drive, the rear drive (and MT) is killer on the M4. But most people under typical daily driving conditions can't control all that torque. The X3M rear-bias differential setup is a much better use of the power IMHO. As you can tell, I am enjoying this car. But, it is true what some reviewers are saying: I can't wait to see what the new M3/M4 is like with this engine and powertrain. It has the potential to be really fantastic. The steering still feels a little dead on center and slightly numb overall (although very precise), but the future looks bright for the M3/M4. The S58 is awesome, next level performance. |
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