[scheherazade]

Imagine that you just want big power, and you are willing to throw away your warranty and pay for any repairs...

Will "detectable" high power configurations cause the ECU to simply set a notification code so the dealer knows?
or
will the ECU actually disable the engine?

I've heard about this 'limp mode', but I've heard people talk about it in various contexts. Some with mods, some with failing fuel pumps, etc. So I don't know if it's detection related, or if it's failure related.

If it's only a matter of the ECU telling on you to the dealer, then I couldn't care less if the dealer knows I modded the car.

Alternatively, is there any source of v80 ECUs so I could just swap for an old ECU?

-scheherazade

[techforge]

If you don't care about a warranty then of course you can do whatever you want. Limp mode is a result of the ecu trying to protect the engine from damage. It's not a proactive attempt to stop modding. I suppose you could buy an ecu - getting hold of the firmware is the problem. Perhaps eventually the direct ecu flashing mods will come to fruition.

[emjei]

if you have the money to pay for repairs then consider the various stages from Dinan...you get power and warranty from them

[scheherazade]

Originally Posted by techforge

If you don't care about a warranty then of course you can do whatever you want.

I can only do what the ECU lets me do. If the ECU will turn the car off on me then I'm pretty much up against a wall.

Originally Posted by techforge

Limp mode is a result of the ecu trying to protect the engine from damage. It's not a proactive attempt to stop modding.

It seems like BMW already made an attempt at hindering mods with changes they made since the early ECUs.

Originally Posted by emjei

if you have the money to pay for repairs then consider the various stages from Dinan...you get power and warranty from them

I do most my own repairs. What I can't do I would take to a family friend's shop where he does bmw and benz work (specialist). I don't particularly want to throw away money (read : for the cost of dinan with what I want to do, I can do my own work on the car for the life of the car). A shop would charge thousands for work that cost me 'tens or hundreds' in parts.

[Dascamel]

Changing the ECU isn't easy...

[scheherazade]

Originally Posted by Dascamel

Changing the ECU isn't easy...

Eh? That's literally one of the simplest things you can do.

The old ecu and the new ecu are physically identical. Only the embedded software version is different. It's a direct swap. Unplug one plug in the other.
Worst case is you have to de-solder, label, and re-solder some wires. Which is time consuming, but you could train a monkey to do it.

-scheherazade

[tek818]

Originally Posted by scheherazade

Eh? That's literally one of the simplest things you can do.

The old ecu and the new ecu are physically identical. Only the embedded software version is different. It's a direct swap. Unplug one plug in the other.
Worst case is you have to de-solder, label, and re-solder some wires. Which is time consuming, but you could train a monkey to do it.

-scheherazade

you have no idea what you are talking about. Changing the DME is an extremely time consuming task as the modules throughout the car are paired with the DME, as are the keys.

[scheherazade]

Originally Posted by tek818

you have no idea what you are talking about. Changing the DME is an extremely time consuming task as the modules throughout the car are paired with the DME, as are the keys.

Guess I don't. Never worked on a 335 before.
What modules are you referring to? (some sensor controller hubs?)
I presume keys are the actual ignition keys that you use in the cab to start the car.

-scheherazade

[camaross305]

Originally Posted by scheherazade

Guess I don't. Never worked on a 335 before.
What modules are you referring to? (some sensor controller hubs?)
I presume keys are the actual ignition keys that you use in the cab to start the car.

-scheherazade

Its almost impossiable to swap out an ecu unless you wanna spend a ton of money....

[scheherazade]

Originally Posted by camaross305

Its almost impossiable to swap out an ecu unless you wanna spend a ton of money....

So the best option would be to find a dealer/mechanic that would be willing to flash the existing ecu to the old v80 software?

-scheherazade

[rlb]

Originally Posted by scheherazade

So the best option would be to find a dealer/mechanic that would be willing to flash the existing ecu to the old v80 software?

-scheherazade

v80 is the hardware(ecu), v29.2 is the software. Since your car is on order it will have v81 ecu and at least v29.2 progman software. Replacing the ecu would be almost impossible since it is registered to specific car. I don't think you would be able to find the older v80 ecu. Also, your car with v81 ecu would not be able to be flashed to a version of software prior to v29.2. All you really need to do is get a Procede V3 or JB3. The Procede "doomsday" map makes almost as much power as the "non-doomsday" map and Shiv said the eventually they will be even closer in power. If you are not concerned about the possibility of your tune being detected and your warranty being voided then just run the full power maps for V3 or JB3.

[camaross305]

Originally Posted by rlb

v80 is the hardware(ecu), v29.2 is the software. Since your car is on order it will have v81 ecu and at least v29.2 progman software. Replacing the ecu would be almost impossible since it is registered to specific car. I don't think you would be able to find the older v80 ecu. Also, your car with v81 ecu would not be able to be flashed to a version of software prior to v29.2. All you really need to do is get a Procede V3 or JB3. The Procede "doomsday" map makes almost as much power as the "non-doomsday" map and Shiv said the eventually they will be even closer in power. If you are not concerned about the possibility of your tune being detected and your warranty being voided then just run the full power maps for V3 or JB3.

ditto the jb3 is only about 5-10 more midrange torque for the older software

[scheherazade]

Originally Posted by rlb

v80 is the hardware(ecu), v29.2 is the software. Since your car is on order it will have v81 ecu and at least v29.2 progman software. Replacing the ecu would be almost impossible since it is registered to specific car. I don't think you would be able to find the older v80 ecu. Also, your car with v81 ecu would not be able to be flashed to a version of software prior to v29.2. All you really need to do is get a Procede V3 or JB3. The Procede "doomsday" map makes almost as much power as the "non-doomsday" map and Shiv said the eventually they will be even closer in power. If you are not concerned about the possibility of your tune being detected and your warranty being voided then just run the full power maps for V3 or JB3.

And being detected won't trigger this 'limp mode' that I've heard about?

-scheherazade

[techforge]

Originally Posted by scheherazade

And being detected won't trigger this 'limp mode' that I've heard about?

-scheherazade

Limp mode has nothing to do with being detected - I tried to make that point in my first post. Limp mode is caused by an actual problem like the engine overheating. It's not a result of bmw trying to stop you from modding.

[darkphantom]

Originally Posted by techforge

Limp mode has nothing to do with being detected - I tried to make that point in my first post. Limp mode is caused by an actual problem like the engine overheating. It's not a result of bmw trying to stop you from modding.

+1

Limp modes or CELs usually occur when the engine reaches a threshold temp, and the ECU basically chokes the engine to perform at half or less than half operating power. The Limp modes are there just to prevent damage.

[1clean335i]

if you have the money, anything is possible... (full standalone)

[rlb]

Originally Posted by scheherazade

And being detected won't trigger this 'limp mode' that I've heard about?

-scheherazade

Nope. Not at all. The limp modes are caused by some type of problem or usually a user install error.

[GGreek5]

I was told that if you have a V81, and you go over the "threshold" it will trigger a half engine power light, until its reset by the dealership.

[GGreek5]

I sent this PM to Terry on N54 tech.


Originally Posted by Ggreek5
Whats up Terry. Quick question, if someone threw the hidden code on the v81, would they know?? Is it actually hidden or is it a cel? Also what kind of computer is needed to reset it?
Thanks
Ari

Would show up as a limp. You need the BMW scanning computer to reset it, some high end shops have them.


T

[scheherazade]

Originally Posted by techforge

Limp mode has nothing to do with being detected - I tried to make that point in my first post. Limp mode is caused by an actual problem like the engine overheating. It's not a result of bmw trying to stop you from modding.

Originally Posted by darkphantom

+1

Limp modes or CELs usually occur when the engine reaches a threshold temp ... The Limp modes are there just to prevent damage.

Understood. My confusion is in what you *really* mean. (clarify please)
Is it :
1) [practical] In all terms, unequivocally, you can install any piggyback and not go limp mode unless literally something breaks.
*or*
2) [ideological] You will go limp mode because of 'problems', not mods. Now whether or not the effects of mods are interpreted as problems by the ECU is another issue that you're not commenting on.

Originally Posted by rlb

Nope. Not at all. The limp modes are caused by some type of problem or usually a user install error.

I'd expect install error. Just fuzzy about what counts as a problem.
I read a thread where someone said that the down pipes they put on triggered limp mode.

Originally Posted by GGreek5

Quick question, if someone threw the hidden code on the v81, would they know??
...
Would show up as a limp.

Define what you mean by "hidden code".
And, so this "hidden code" is another cause for limp mode.

Originally Posted by GGreek5

I was told that if you have a V81, and you go over the "threshold" it will trigger a half engine power light, until its reset by the dealership.

Some internal parameter goes over some threshold? (like MAF sensor shows something unusual)
If this is the case, is there an 'ignore' option somewhere that would let you cross a threshold without intervention?


So the running total for what causes limp mode is :
1) Run the car WOT for a long time (overheat)
2) Don't follow instructions when installing the piggyback
3) ECU detects malfunctions/problems
4) "hidden code"
5) Too much of something? (#3 basically?)


-scheherazade


p.s. Sorry if i'm beating a dead horse here. I'm just trying to get a feel for what sort of modding I can expect. Looking forward to having a bit of a project car out of this one.

[G35revup]

Terry on N54 tech? Is that the same guy who is selling Radio Shack 9.6v Turbo Tunes? Thats like putting a $10 saddle on a $100,000 horse.

[GGreek5]

Originally Posted by G35revup

Terry on N54 tech? Is that the same guy who is selling Radio Shack 9.6v Turbo Tunes? Thats like putting a $10 saddle on a $100,000 horse.

Do you have any idea wtf you're talkin about?? Do you know what the JB3 is??