[M_Six]

My PoE cam system has an 8-port PoE switch mounted in the attic. It's been working fine until today, but it's bitter cold today. It's 12F in my attic now. The listed operating range for the switch I have is 0-65C, so 12F is obviously well below that range. The web interface from the cams, which are all connected to that switch, are working fine. Nice clear video at 1080p. But the feed going through my Synology NAS using Surveillance Station is very erratic. The images keep graying out and then pop back. And the feed from the recordings just play a few seconds and then loop, or bizarrely, jump back and forth a few seconds.

The NAS is in the garage, which is at 45F, so easily within the operating range of the NAS. So I'm wondering if it is the cold temp in the attic affecting the switch. It's a TP-Link switch, if that matters.

Also, the NAS and my laptop in the garage are on the same gig switch sitting between them, so that switch is also at 45F. Still, the video coming from the NAS is choppy. It could be that the recording are, in fact, a choppy mess.

TL;DR: Can a switch be adversely affected by temps 20 degrees F below the published operating range?

EDIT:

As an Ethernet switch approaches the limits of its acceptable temperature range, the device may start slowing down and dropping packets. Dropped packets can cause a number of different latency issues that may include “choppy” video, blank screens, interrupted emails and other degraded data transfers.

So I guess I have my answer. Have to find somewhere other than the attic to locate that switch. Rats, it was a nice setup, too.

[zx10guy]

You can run a continuous ping test along side the video stream to see if any if the ICMP packets are being dropped. I sometimes do this as a quick and dirty way to check the quality/stability of the network connection.

Having a non ruggedized/environmentally hardened device in an environment such as an attic is not recommended. While the attic is enclosed, you still have air flow due to how the attic is set up to vent. Over time, dust and other junk will collect inside of that network switch. I have some PC equipment in my garage and I'm surprised how much junk settles on the electronic components. This would also apply to your NAS.

[Maynard]

You could do what I do with my water feed in the garage - park a lamp with a 60+ watt bulb right next to it to keep temps up. We only turn it on when things get real cold. I know it is furiously low tech, but for the short term it may help.

[M_Six]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

You can run a continuous ping test along side the video stream to see if any if the ICMP packets are being dropped. I sometimes do this as a quick and dirty way to check the quality/stability of the network connection.

Having a non ruggedized/environmentally hardened device in an environment such as an attic is not recommended. While the attic is enclosed, you still have air flow due to how the attic is set up to vent. Over time, dust and other junk will collect inside of that network switch. I have some PC equipment in my garage and I'm surprised how much junk settles on the electronic components. This would also apply to your NAS.

Yeah, the dust and bugs were my concern about any equipment in the garage. The NAS is there now just because I'm setting it up on my workbench. It'll be located inside the house when I'm finished testing. I was just looking at non-metallic network equipment enclosures. Pretty inexpensive and I thought if I used one of those and placed it on the floor of the attic (IOW, just above the ceilings in the house) and covered it with a layer of insulation, it would stay above freezing.

I've started making a raceway between the attic above the garage and a spot in my basement where I want to have a network rack for all my equipment. But that is a slow process as it involves running conduit from the attic to the basement as well as setting up patch panels and so on. But when it's done, all the CAT6 in the attic will run down to the basement. Our basement is finished, so no temp or humidity issues there.

[M_Six]

Originally Posted by Maynard

You could do what I do with my water feed in the garage - park a lamp with a 60+ watt bulb right next to it to keep temps up. We only turn it on when things get real cold. I know it is furiously low tech, but for the short term it may help.

I've read that elsewhere. I have just the device for it, too.

[zx10guy]

You have that PoE switch buried under attic insulation?

[M_Six]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

You can run a continuous ping test along side the video stream to see if any if the ICMP packets are being dropped. I sometimes do this as a quick and dirty way to check the quality/stability of the network connection.

Great idea. I ran that on two cams with avg time of 15ms. No packet loss. Then I ran it on the switch and had no packet loss and again, avg time in the teens. But that included two pings of 250 and 325ms. So maybe a few hiccups. I'm going to try the lightbulb trick.

[M_Six]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

You have that PoE switch buried under attic insulation?

No. It's mounted on a post. I was thinking of putting it in an enclosure and then putting some sort of non-fibrous insulation around the box.

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by M_Six

No. It's mounted on a post. I was thinking of putting it in an enclosure and then putting some sort of non-fibrous insulation around the box.

PoE switches need to breath. I'm guessing the switch you have doesn't have any active fans and operates under passive cooling. Choking off any air flow/ventilation to any device....especially a PoE switch....is going to kill off that device in no time.

I know you're looking to do this on the cheap. But if you are going to leave a network switch in an unconditioned/non ideal environment, you really should look at a ruggedized/industrial switch. These switches are designed to be exposed to the elements. The entire chassis of the switch is sealed. The chassis serves as the heat sink for the electronics and they're designed to work in a very wide temperature range. But they're not cheap.

[M_Six]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

PoE switches need to breath. I'm guessing the switch you have doesn't have any active fans and operates under passive cooling. Choking off any air flow/ventilation to any device....especially a PoE switch....is going to kill off that device in no time.

I know you're looking to do this on the cheap. But if you are going to leave a network switch in an unconditioned/non ideal environment, you really should look at a ruggedized/industrial switch. These switches are designed to be exposed to the elements. The entire chassis of the switch is sealed. The chassis serves as the heat sink for the electronics and they're designed to work in a very wide temperature range. But they're not cheap.

I'll look into it. I don't mind spending some money on it, but some of the higher end PoE switches I looked at were in the $500+ range. That's too much just to store something in the attic. It'd be more cost effective to move the switch.

Here's my setup for now. 60W lightbulb and a cam to monitor it. I also stuck a second thermometer up there to compare against the one I already had there. The new thermometer is sitting atop the switches, so should reflect the temp right there at the switches.

[zx10guy]

Here's an option:

https://www.amazon.com/UltraPoe-Outd...eae8f9840&th=1

Has an operating range of -25C to 65C and up to 90% noncondensing humidity.

Don't have any experience with this company. Black Box is a well known brand with ruggedized/industrial PoE switches.

[zx10guy]

Actually, this will probably be a better switch for you. Looking over the specs again for teh above linked switch, it operates on UPoE/PoE+. It doesn't have an internal power supply or ability to work with a walwart. So if you want to go with this one, you'll need an inline PoE+ or better power injector.

This one can run off of A/C power:

https://www.amazon.com/Outdoor-Gigab...eae8f9840&th=1

Only catch is you have to wire in your own power cord. There are screw in terminals for you to attach a power wired power cord.

[M_Six]

Thanks. I'd need two of these, but I'll think about it if I determine the issue is the switch. I just went back and looked at some recordings from previous days and they all play fine. So I'm assuming the problem is from the extreme cold. The bad recordings are only from today after it got cold and it appears the recordings themselves are bad.

But here's the rub...I have 4 Amcrest IP8M-T2669E-AI cams and 3 IP8M-T2599E cams. The T2669 cams are the pricier ones with 3 possible stream resolutions and AI to tell humans and vehicles apart from other movement. The T2599 cams have only two stream resolutions and no AI. They're accordingly cheaper cams. But it's the higher end cams that are messing up. The recordings from the lower end cams are fine. Still 4k and smooth as glass. So it appears the T2669 cams have a problem with the cold temps, which ticks me off.

[Jeffcharger]

Just food for thought….. I have been running a computer, router, DVI’s, and some cameras for 10+ years in an unheated, Canadian cottage with no I’ll effects.

Initially, I built bird houses with light bulbs for heat in the winter, but found that they weren’t needed. Now; I haven’t monitored for lost packets or other performance issues, but I have been surprised that cold hasn’t been an issue. (I would think that humidity would be an issue if heating an enclosure.


… just food for thought

[M_Six]

Originally Posted by Jeffcharger

Just food for thought….. I have been running a computer, router, DVI’s, and some cameras for 10+ years in an unheated, Canadian cottage with no I’ll effects.

Initially, I built bird houses with light bulbs for heat in the winter, but found that they weren’t needed. Now; I haven’t monitored for lost packets or other performance issues, but I have been surprised that cold hasn’t been an issue. (I would think that humidity would be an issue if heating an enclosure.


… just food for thought

I tried the light bulb bit, but there is no enclosure around the switches, so the light bulb wasn't really having any effect. But I reduced the resolution of the cams and moved some of them from the main PoE switch to a secondary one to lessen the power usage on the main switch. The cams are much more stable now.

[2000cs]

Lightbulb trick is/was commonly used for well pumps and similar to prevent freezing - but requires an incandescent 100w (or higher) bulb to put off enough heat. You also could look at the pipe-wrap heat tape (also electric) - probably more reliable than a bulb and won’t attract moths. The heat of either solution could attract snakes or rodents if they are in the vicinity. Maybe a low temp switch to activate, or a wall switch so you don’t have to go up in the attic to switch on/off.