meth failsafe for flashed cars

PlutoniumTans · 10-12-2011, 11:41 AM

I know everyone is stressing about failsafe when it comes to a flash tune, and on the forums vendors push their own systems that are compatible with their piggyback systems, mean while many other comunities use meth, so how are we any different ?

So far as I understand most use failsafe modules by connecting the 12v wire to the waste gate solenoid. The loss of flow will send a 12v signal to the solenoid and it takes 12v for the wastegate to open, and an open solenoid will cuase the boost to drop.

themyst · 10-12-2011, 11:43 AM

no you connect the 5V trigger output from the failsafe to a boost bypass solenoid.

PlutoniumTans · 10-12-2011, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by themyst

no you connect the 5V trigger output from the failsafe to a boost bypass solenoid.

Boost bypass solenoid is located on the right side of the intake manifold ? there are two of them no ?

PlutoniumTans · 10-12-2011, 03:51 PM

No one else wants to discuss it ?

pcockley · 10-12-2011, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PlutoniumTans

No one else wants to discuss it ?

For my 5 cents, I suspect those with meth figure best option is to pick one of the 2 piggies and use their integrated fsb

sounds like the easy option to me.

cwn23 · 10-12-2011, 05:47 PM

If its not broke why fix it! The way the failsafes are working with Procede and JB4 are pretty much fool proof, why change it and go another direction. I am sure once Cobb integrates meth into their maps this solution.

99three · 10-12-2011, 05:53 PM

What meth kit and flash do you have?
Austin @GIAC suggested that the ECU takes over when the knock sensor and dials back boost when in an unsafe condition.

boom · 10-12-2011, 05:57 PM

Personally i view meth as an enhancement and not a requirement. You get into trouble when you NEED to run meth to keep your tune safe. If you've advanced the timing and leaned things down depending on a couple hundred dollars worth of tubing and failsafes to keep your 10K motor safe you better be doing it in an application that you can afford to lose. Run a safe tune that will benefit from cooling and increased octane and you'll get the benefits without the worry of problems WHEN things don't work properly.

The Ghost · 10-12-2011, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boom

Personally i view meth as an enhancement and not a requirement. You get into trouble when you NEED to run meth to keep your tune safe. If you've advanced the timing and leaned things down depending on a couple hundred dollars worth of tubing and failsafes to keep your 10K motor safe you better be doing it in an application that you can afford to lose. Run a safe tune that will benefit from cooling and increased octane and you'll get the benefits without the worry of problems WHEN things don't work properly.

You run meth and race gas for the sole purpose of running a tune that cannot be supported on pump alone. If you are afraid, don't mod your car. Raising the octane on a tune that doesn't require it will slow combustion and lower performance all things left the same, so the aggressive timing/boost/AFR is the sole point of the "benefits of increased octane."

tibra1 · 10-12-2011, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 99three

What meth kit and flash do you have?
Austin @GIAC suggested that the ECU takes over when the knock sensor and dials back boost when in an unsafe condition.

Mr 5 ran GIAC stg 2 race w 91 and meth for a while..does anyone know if he ever used a failsafe?

pcockley · 10-12-2011, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tibra1

Mr 5 ran GIAC stg 2 race w 91 and meth for a while..does anyone know if he ever used a failsafe?

But isn't the point of running meth to BOOST power

From what I have read the flashers can't make use of the added benefits of meth so why bother at all

tibra1 · 10-12-2011, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pcockley

But isn't the point of running meth to BOOST power

From what I have read the flashers can't make use of the added benefits of meth so why bother at all

Depends which re-flash..I have the GIAC stg 2 w pump and race maps..race can absolutely take advantage of the meth..adds 2 degrees of timing + ~1-2 psi boost..w that map u have to run 100 octane or min 91 + meth...i personally would run race gas w it... but meth is obviously cheaper..

The failsafe is what concerns me..and pump map has been plenty so far..so havent explored meth..but still curious.

ruphianh · 10-12-2011, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tibra1

Mr 5 ran GIAC stg 2 race w 91 and meth for a while..does anyone know if he ever used a failsafe?

I don't get why you wouldn't just go with a tune that has failsafe built in?

tibra1 · 10-12-2011, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ruphianh

I don't get why you wouldn't just go with a tune that has failsafe built in?

For all I know GIAC has one..i just havent researched it....

Which "reflash" tune has failsafe built into it that u know of..obviously not piggys.,,not thats not an option

ruphianh · 10-12-2011, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tibra1

For all I know GIAC has one..i just havent researched it....

Which "reflash" tune has failsafe built into it that u know of..obviously not piggys.,,not thats not an option

Vishnu has failsafe built in. When meth doesn't flow, the tune switches from meth tune to premium aftermarket pump tune. Its built in. Peace of mind. It happens in milliseconds. No risk.

Its a piggy. So it may be possible you heard some incorrect information.

tibra1 · 10-12-2011, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ruphianh

Vishnu has failsafe built in. When meth doesn't flow, the tune switches from meth tune to premium aftermarket pump tune. Its built in. Peace of mind. It happens in milliseconds. No risk.

Its a piggy. So it may be possible you heard some incorrect information.

Maybe i wasnt clear but piggys are not an option...Im not interested in piggys..the thread is about failsafes for reflashes..but thx for the info

ruphianh · 10-12-2011, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tibra1

Maybe i wasnt clear but piggys are not an option...Im not interested in piggys..the thread is about failsafes for reflashes..but thx for the info

Why aren't they an option?

99three · 10-12-2011, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ruphianh

Vishnu has failsafe built in. When meth doesn't flow, the tune switches from meth tune to premium aftermarket pump tune. Its built in. Peace of mind. It happens in milliseconds. No risk.

Its a piggy. So it may be possible you heard some incorrect information.

Huh...Are you saying that the piggy maps are switched upon lean/no flow detection all on by itself? The original question was if there is a flash with a failsafe map....so far I haven't found one. Besides, piggies are not as quick as as innate ECU program.

Brey335i · 10-12-2011, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ruphianh

Why aren't they an option?

because this thread is about failsafes on flashed cars

cwn23 · 10-12-2011, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ruphianh

Vishnu has failsafe built in. When meth doesn't flow, the tune switches from meth tune to premium aftermarket pump tune. Its built in. Peace of mind. It happens in milliseconds. No risk.

Its a piggy. So it may be possible you heard some incorrect information.

I think you have it backwards. With procede meth integration failsafe when there is enough flow the procede transitions to a more aggressive setup (map). When there is no flow or insufficient flow (blockage, leak) the procede never changes over to aggressive map and stays on the regular pump gas map and settings.

tibra1 · 10-12-2011, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brey335i

because this thread is about failsafes on flashed cars

..just one thread PLEASE that stays on topic..good grief.

pcockley · 10-12-2011, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tibra1

..just one thread PLEASE that stays on topic..good grief.

Sorry chap, I suspect I am the cause of the

.

I was merely thinking out loud that there probably isn't a fail safe that can be integrated with a flash, simply due to the nature of the flash.

Whereas a piggy has additional hardware that controls map switching based on meth flow.

10-12-2011, 11:41 AM	#1
PlutoniumTans Lieutenant 22 Rep 575 Posts Drives: 335i Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Brooklyn,NY iTrader: (2)	meth failsafe for flashed cars I know everyone is stressing about failsafe when it comes to a flash tune, and on the forums vendors push their own systems that are compatible with their piggyback systems, mean while many other comunities use meth, so how are we any different ? So far as I understand most use failsafe modules by connecting the 12v wire to the waste gate solenoid. The loss of flow will send a 12v signal to the solenoid and it takes 12v for the wastegate to open, and an open solenoid will cuase the boost to drop. Last edited by PlutoniumTans; 10-12-2011 at 03:51 PM..
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10-12-2011, 11:43 AM	#2
themyst Major General 178 Rep 6,631 Posts Drives: '16 MK7 GTI Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: NYC iTrader: (8)	no you connect the 5V trigger output from the failsafe to a boost bypass solenoid. __________________ E90 LCI N54 6AT
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10-12-2011, 03:51 PM	#4
PlutoniumTans Lieutenant 22 Rep 575 Posts Drives: 335i Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Brooklyn,NY iTrader: (2)	No one else wants to discuss it ?
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10-12-2011, 05:47 PM	#6
cwn23 Major 23 Rep 1,142 Posts Drives: E92 Join Date: May 2007 Location: USA iTrader: (0)	If its not broke why fix it! The way the failsafes are working with Procede and JB4 are pretty much fool proof, why change it and go another direction. I am sure once Cobb integrates meth into their maps this solution. Last edited by cwn23; 10-12-2011 at 06:16 PM..
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10-12-2011, 05:53 PM	#7
99three Banned 25 Rep 838 Posts Drives: 993, e92, e36, F355, Z32, Jag Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: in the 416 iTrader: (3)	What meth kit and flash do you have? Austin @GIAC suggested that the ECU takes over when the knock sensor and dials back boost when in an unsafe condition.
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10-12-2011, 05:57 PM	#8
boom My X5d tows my spec miata to the track. 74 Rep 1,254 Posts Drives: 2010 X5 35d Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: USA iTrader: (0)	Personally i view meth as an enhancement and not a requirement. You get into trouble when you NEED to run meth to keep your tune safe. If you've advanced the timing and leaned things down depending on a couple hundred dollars worth of tubing and failsafes to keep your 10K motor safe you better be doing it in an application that you can afford to lose. Run a safe tune that will benefit from cooling and increased octane and you'll get the benefits without the worry of problems WHEN things don't work properly.
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