07-07-2022, 06:05 PM | #45 | ||
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07-07-2022, 06:59 PM | #46 |
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It’s unfortunate what happened - people died or got injured, for no fault of their own.
That the parent(s) of the shooter abetted his crime makes it worse - they knew, and could’ve stopped said individual, but they didn’t. More gun laws would not have stopped this. The issue is of mental health - and yes, I realize everyone sees that as a sound bite to shirk responsibility. The issues in society today that are leading to tragedies such as this one, are: - the role of media - be they violence in movies, games, etc - desensitizing us as a whole - the role of media in creating role models in film, tv, etc where the creation of dangerous role models and behavior is being rewarded rather than condemned - “social” media is just the newest form of this enablement upon impressionable minds - both sex and violence - parental role models (or the lack thereof) due to the breakdown of family structure - parents refusing to accept responsibility for their wards, trying to be friends instead of authority figures with a responsibility to raise a child in a stable, healthy environment (instead of parking them in front of a tv or a computer tablet) - parents refusing to accept responsibility that their child may indeed have a mental disorder that needs treatment rather than just acceptance / twisting the world to accept what is a new normal. That’s just an injustice to normalcy. Which brings me to my next 2 points of: - stricter punishment (across all aspects - home, law) - mental / psych facilities, Both being necessary. These may seem like harsh words to some of you. So in closing, I will leave you with these 2 bits of data: This desensitization and covert encouragement to kill or otherwise commit acts of violence are a technique that was successfully used by the US armed forces to increase the shooting rate (the number of soldiers who will fire their weapon upon an enemy in combat) from 15-20% in the Second World War to 95% in Vietnam. The American Psychological Association’s commission on violence and youth concluded in 1993 that “there is absolutely no doubt that higher levels of viewing violence on television are correlated with increased acceptance of aggressive attitudes and increased aggressive behavior.” |
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07-07-2022, 07:46 PM | #47 | |
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All valid points. That's the discussion we should really be having because those are the underlying issues. |
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07-07-2022, 08:43 PM | #48 |
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Until we actually start giving a shit about the mental well-being of our citizens, this sort of tragedy will continue to happen.
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07-07-2022, 08:58 PM | #49 |
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My state gave up on the mental health of the citizens here the moment they closed a bunch of the state hospitals and limited funding. It's a lengthy timeline of things that occurred that got us to this point. It's out of control now.
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07-07-2022, 09:18 PM | #50 | |
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The entire mental health system in this country is an utter mess. |
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07-07-2022, 09:20 PM | #51 | ||
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07-07-2022, 10:32 PM | #52 | ||
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however, I've used 30 round mags of .223 for hunting plenty of times. Prairie dogs, ferral pigs, coyotes. Not all hunting is bambi at 50 yards from a tree stand |
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07-07-2022, 10:48 PM | #53 | |
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07-07-2022, 10:55 PM | #54 | |
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07-08-2022, 05:55 AM | #55 | |
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b. When they wrote that most were using smooth bore, muzzle loading guns (rifling was still an upgrade for most). And, again, can you even quote the WHOLE 2nd amendment? Because nobody ever wants to mention the first part, which is that guns were necessary because they didn't want a standing army and states were supposed to maintain militias, and now we have a standing army and there are no regulated state militias, so it seems the "everyone can have every gun ever made" is the only thing we took from that. |
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07-08-2022, 05:56 AM | #56 |
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What the everloving hell are you talking about? 223 spins, all bullets out of a rifle spin. Do you supposed gun nuts even go within 10ft of guns?
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07-08-2022, 05:59 AM | #57 | |
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Its probably just because our cops are worthless then, right? They dont enforce the ones on the books now... |
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07-08-2022, 06:00 AM | #58 | |
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Also, Ive literally called bullshit on many of your points you have failed to refute, literally the closest you got outside of an emotional argument is ONE GUY who is good at shooting without structured training (which I suspect he had structured training). In the aggregate its still moronic to compare your average fuckwit to a a soldier who has had military training in an organized setting on how to operate a gun safely. There is a reason its national fucking news with some soldier gets shot in a training accident and not when some idiot shoots himself (unless its funny and it ends up on tosh). Im still waiting for that "most americans arent for UBCs" claim you made. Just more facile arguments based on the feels. |
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07-08-2022, 10:19 AM | #59 | |
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What I mean by tumble is that the bullet tumbles or kart wheels inside of your body. Like a helicopter blade or like spinning a bottle. Edit: Dude, after reading most of you're replies I think you're mistaking me for someone who thinks everyone needs a high powered rifle. I do not own a gun, nor am I interested in owning one. I know the disadvantage this puts me in, but I'm really not worried about it. |
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07-08-2022, 10:35 AM | #60 | |
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07-08-2022, 12:54 PM | #61 | |
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And admit it, many people that buy these rifles have a "want to play soldier" complex. They're not buying M1s or other semi-auto rifles and modding them. They're buying AR style rifles like they see the military carrying and what they see in the movies and video games they play. There is no denying that AR-15 style rifles are the #1 rifle of choice in mass shootings in the US since becoming readily available in the mid-2000s. Starting in around 2010ish, mass shootings took off with the AR-15 being the "gun". Please show me data in the past ~10-15 years showing mass shooters using any other style of semi-automatic rifle/pistol with such regularity and with such a high body count. I'm not saying to take them away, but WAY more needs to be done if you want to be eligible to buy one. And yeah, other high-power rifles that have potential for multi-round mag capacity and are semi-automatic should also be placed in the same bucket. Rules, laws, regulations, etc. should always be up for debate, revision, revocation, etc. and I would think that any responsible gun advocate would be supportive of this. Lastly, anyone that helps someone buy one of these rifles and was knowingly aware of concerns regarding that person should be very concerned about criminal charges and civil lawsuits. Even if the dad of the Highland Park shooter isn't found guilty of some level of criminal liability, he will certainly be found guilty of some level of civil liability in lawsuits brought against him by the victim's families. His financial well being is done for. The same scenario can be said for someone that doesn't lock up their guns and one of your family commits a crime, accidently shoots a friend, etc.
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07-08-2022, 01:51 PM | #63 | |
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07-08-2022, 03:20 PM | #64 | ||
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You're entitled to your opinion(s), but I need to refute two specific statements and affirm the facts….. ….people have been using the AR for hunting since its inception (…not that the 2nd Amendment has anything to do with hunting, nor requires it as justification). It is a great tool for hunting and depending on configuration, a great tool for home defense as well……especially against multiple intruders. ….the AR became readily available to the public in the early 1950's. It was available for nearly 40 years before mass shootings became a thing, so it wasn't the rifle that changed……it was the people… …..which circles us back to society, mental health, etc. |
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07-08-2022, 04:32 PM | #65 | |
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LOL a LOT of horribly wrong firearms "facts" in here Sedan - you keep correcting them but they don't wanna hear it. This is why we don't like people who have no clue about firearms making firearms laws. "ugg, gun black, black bad, gun bad, ban gun." Keep up the good fight!
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07-08-2022, 05:51 PM | #66 |
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I need to buy an AR before there is a ban is all I am hearing.
Also, the more you learn about the family there were red alerts all over the place. Such a shame this could have been avoided. |
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