I've made a terrible mistake - test drove a 2018 Cayman S PDK

[JoeFromPA]

All,

I have 47k miles on my '15 F80 m3 6mt. I've considered getting ridden of it but it's just been a spotless all around excellent vehicle. For the sake of this commentary, know that I'm riding on 18" wheels rocking 265/285 continental DW tires (i.e. slightly taller and wider than stock).

My boss just bought a fully loaded 2017 Cayman S. It was a dealer car loaded with every option. PASM, 20" wheels, Sport Chrono, etc.

He handed me the keys and let me drive it the way it's meant to be. And now I can't get it out of my head.

First, let me acknowledge I'm comparing a 4-door sedan to a 2-door mid-engine car. But I'm not comparing their track capabilities. The cayman DROVE better.

I realize this can become a contentious topic because it's the subjective. The feel of a chassis, steering feel, braking feel, ride quality, response, sound, etc.

What first hit me was I drove over a patch of broken up pavement I've driven over many times in the m3. It creates substantial body movements and chassis disruption. It doesn't feel good either. In the Cayman in Sport mode, it floated over it. You felt it, you felt connected to the road, it just didn't bother the cayman.

As I began to toss it around more I began to realize all of it's manners just felt like a higher level than I'm used to.

Now I can't stop thinking about it and need to go drive a 911 with PASM. I can't do a cayman with 3 boys - it's just not right as I'd never be able to take them with me. But if a new(ish) 911 drives like this...

Just wanted to share this.

Joe

P.s. I haven't driven an f8x comp package yet, which I understand also offers a superior suspension feel/ride quality than the adaptive suspension 2015 f8x.

[gatorfast]

No doubt that Porsche makes a proper sports car. Good luck on your search if you decide to go that direction. However if you are looking at 911s, be prepared to spend $100+.

[Graves]

That's how I felt going from nothing but Mustangs, camaro's, and other mediocre American and Japanese sports cars to my ZR1. Night and day difference. I'm really looking forward to my M3 as a daily.

Good luck on your quest. You should never have driven the Porsche, lmao.

[quattr0]

Originally Posted by gatorfast

No doubt that Porsche makes a proper sports car. Good luck on your search if you decide to go that direction. However if you are looking at 911s, be prepared to spend $100+.

There are plenty 991.2 used in the high 80's.

[guess2098]

MSRP of his cayman and how much is your m3?

[Darth One]

Hmm....so what answer are you really looking for here

Perhaps you shouldn't drive the 911 because what you are afraid (hoping?) is going to happen...is going to happen.

How big are your boys? Putting anyone over 4-4.5 feet tall in the back seats of a 911 is not a good thing to do, unless you're punishing them

[Manbearpigbear]

Porsche>BMW everyone knows that

[JoeFromPA]

Originally Posted by guess2098

MSRP of his cayman and how much is your m3?

m3 MSRP is ~$65k now. Cayman MSRP is $59k, Cayman S MSRP at $69k.

So.....your point?

[Habber]

I've never done drugs...

I've never done Porsches...

Just don't want to mess up my life.

[JoeFromPA]

Originally Posted by Darth One

Hmm....so what answer are you really looking for here

Perhaps you shouldn't drive the 911 because what you are afraid (hoping?) is going to happen...is going to happen.

How big are your boys? Putting anyone over 4-4.5 feet tall in the back seats of a 911 is not a good thing to do, unless you're punishing them

Boys are nearly 6, 3, and 0 years of age. The nearly 6 year old is 50.5" tall - very tall for his age.

[quattr0]

Joe, you prolly already knew, based on my previous posts, but I was you 2+ yrs ago, sold the manual M4 and bought a manual C2.

My son was 5'6 when we took an 1.15 hrs trip and he's okay, not comfortable obviously. My daughter, 5'2 was in the back seat also. I wouldn't do it in a 2 hours trip. Of course, we could have taken my wife SUV but I wanted to drive the 911.

You have a really nice boss! Life is too short man. You won't regret it. Now I'm looking for something similar/close to 911 handling where I could daily it but can't think of one lol Maybe the TT RS...Just maybe.

[nicknaz]

Hi Joe,

I think before you give up on the f80 try to ride in one with an aftermarket full coilovers setup (+/- R tires). A baller $$ onlins or jrz setup might get you closer to what you want without needing to move to a p-car

Also, my $0.02 is don't necessarily think that a 911 will be better than a cayman. It's pretty different "feel" in my opinion, with the mid vs rear engine

Another idea is that you could keep your f80 and get someone's "spec boxster" or "spec 996" as a toy. The ones prepped for timed competition are more fun than the stockers and you can really toss them around since they are relatively cheap used cars with full safety equipment.

Don't bother resisting, just add a pure sports car to live with your f80

[Absurdium]

Good write-up.

I also drove a 718 Cayman S in the past year but came away with a different impression. The car is definitely agile but to me lacked presence. The engine is not very inspiring, with its flat 4 sound. The F8X actually sounds better, which seems like a big insult to any car that you can say that about. The interior did not seem to reflect its price point, which is a close if not over 100k (CAD) car. Now I don't doubt that it handles better, given its lower weight and better weight distribution, but I believe a car is about the sum of its traits, not just one in particular. To me, the Cayman seemed to be a dynamically capable car but the driving experience was not there for me.

Now at this point you may think I'm just a Porsche hater but that's very far from the truth. Subsequently, I drove a 981.1 Cayman GTS and was just blown away by that car. The interior is actually more dated, but has Alcantara everywhere so it feels very plush. I don't think the car is actually any faster than the 718 Cayman S but it certainly felt like it with that blissful flat 6 sound. The 981.1 Cayman GTS was the real deal... However, that car had a sticker price of 120k CAD and this was in 2017 where as it was a 2016 model. That to me feels like a lot of money when you can comfortably spec out an individual M4 for the same price. The fact that BMW financial services offer much more attractive options than Porsche FS also made it easier for me to see the value proposition in a M4.

However, these are my impressions and mine alone. The 718 is a great driver's car so if you think it's right for you, I think you'll be very happy with it.

[guess2098]

Originally Posted by JoeFromPA

m3 MSRP is ~$65k now. Cayman MSRP is $59k, Cayman S MSRP at $69k.

So.....your point?

So with 4K difference you can buy a set of kw 3way or jrz 2way or moton 2 way. It will make your m3 much much better. If you don't care about noise, moton is one of the best with real rear coilover .

[shortseller]

Originally Posted by Darth One

Hmm....so what answer are you really looking for here

Perhaps you shouldn't drive the 911 because what you are afraid (hoping?) is going to happen...is going to happen.

How big are your boys? Putting anyone over 4-4.5 feet tall in the back seats of a 911 is not a good thing to do, unless you're punishing them

Actually many reviewers have made bold statements that the Cayman is now the best handling Porsche out there today, minus the 918 Spyder. And the 911 sadly has going the way of most modern bloated sport cars, relatively speaking as compared to previous older models of course...Not that I would ever turn down a 911!

OP, the Cayman in S or GT form is killer! Only if I could afford one the way I want it.

[996ttelise]

Originally Posted by JoeFromPA

Boys are nearly 6, 3, and 0 years of age. The nearly 6 year old is 50.5" tall - very tall for his age.

I had my older daughters riding in backs of 911s from infant through high school. They never complained. It’s doable.

[996ttelise]

Originally Posted by shortseller

Actually many reviewers have made bold statements that the Cayman is now the best handling Porsche out there today, minus the 918 Spyder. And the 911 sadly has going the way of most modern bloated sport cars, relatively speaking as compared to previous older models of course...Not that I would ever turn down a 911!

OP, the Cayman in S or GT form is killer! Only if I could afford one the way I want it.

Nah, 911s are better than ever from a drivers’ perspective. I have used them as daily drivers since the late 80s.

[eonflux]

Yup, that was a mistake.

Pretty much everything you enjoy about driving your M3 is notably better in a Cayman or 911. The way 911s come out of corners and curved on ramps is so much fun.

I had a 991, but then needed 4 doors with 4 real seats. Can't wait to get back into a 911.
992 release may be about the right time for the move back.

[Darth One]

Originally Posted by shortseller

Actually many reviewers have made bold statements that the Cayman is now the best handling Porsche out there today, minus the 918 Spyder. And the 911 sadly has going the way of most modern bloated sport cars, relatively speaking as compared to previous older models of course...Not that I would ever turn down a 911!

OP, the Cayman in S or GT form is killer! Only if I could afford one the way I want it.

I have both of them and agree. But no surprises there - lighter, mid engine layout vs inherently compromised rear engine layout, blah blah

I'm kind of ignoring the Cayman because of the fitting three boys requirement

[mmmmQuattro]

Originally Posted by 996ttelise

I had my older daughters riding in backs of 911s from infant through high school. They never complained. It’s doable.

Yeah - but how tall were they ?

There's like no room in the back of a 911.

[mechanic75]

Get your software updated then see how you feel about it.

[Thescout13]

Originally Posted by Absurdium

Good write-up.

I also drove a 718 Cayman S in the past year but came away with a different impression. The car is definitely agile but to me lacked presence. The engine is not very inspiring, with its flat 4 sound. The F8X actually sounds better, which seems like a big insult to any car that you can say that about. The interior did not seem to reflect its price point, which is a close if not over 100k (CAD) car. Now I don't doubt that it handles better, given its lower weight and better weight distribution, but I believe a car is about the sum of its traits, not just one in particular. To me, the Cayman seemed to be a dynamically capable car but the driving experience was not there for me.

Now at this point you may think I'm just a Porsche hater but that's very far from the truth. Subsequently, I drove a 981.1 Cayman GTS and was just blown away by that car. The interior is actually more dated, but has Alcantara everywhere so it feels very plush. I don't think the car is actually any faster than the 718 Cayman S but it certainly felt like it with that blissful flat 6 sound. The 981.1 Cayman GTS was the real deal... However, that car had a sticker price of 120k CAD and this was in 2017 where as it was a 2016 model. That to me feels like a lot of money when you can comfortably spec out an individual M4 for the same price. The fact that BMW financial services offer much more attractive options than Porsche FS also made it easier for me to see the value proposition in a M4.

However, these are my impressions and mine alone. The 718 is a great driver's car so if you think it's right for you, I think you'll be very happy with it.

I get where you are coming from. I am not agreeing with you per se, but I get it.

It's all about emotion. For example when I sit in an M3 or a C63S coupe and drive them I get all the emotions, but the M4 doesn't do it for me. No idea why.

Cars need to give you emotions and those emotions are not necessarily the same for every person.