First Post: 128i versus 328xi coupe in Colorado

sensasia · 04-08-2010, 12:41 AM

As my first post, I have to say that I've been an active forum member on several motorcycle/automotive forums but the input and information here far exceeds many of them. Otherwise, I'm currently in the market for a replacement for my Accord and I've only found one other post related to this topic, though, it didn't have exactly the kind of information I was looking for:

Having recently test drove a 2010 128i, I completely fell in love with the feedback of the handling and overall driving experience. My most major concern, however, was realistically driving the vehicle in the snow (I understand that many members have testified to the 1er's ability in the snow but I don't see how a RWD, even with snow tires, can survive some of the snow-storms here in CO). Having said that, I test drove a 2007 328xi. Both the 1er and 328xi were 6MT, black on black, and look great; however, the 328xi really lacked the driving experience of the 1er. In fact, I would go as far as to say that the 328xi was similar to a G37S I drove in that it was almost too comfortable for my taste, even though it is a refined and winter-safe car. I did, however, like how mature the 328xi is as it is a more practical car in the long run.

So, the question is: In your ownership knowledge, is the experience of owning and driving a 128i worth passing up a 328xi, even while the 1er demands more care in the winter?

Thanks and I'd appreciate any information, opinions, or experiences that would help me narrow which to set my sights on.

fwmcb · 04-08-2010, 04:51 AM

Honestly, we get quite a bit of snow up here. And my 128i works great in the snow. The only times that rwd isn't enough you probably shouldn't be out.

Dackelone · 04-08-2010, 05:01 AM

As long as you get an extra set of wheels/snow tires/and TPMS(tire pressure sensors) you will be ok. That is what I did and I never got stuck in the whote stuff. The most snow I had drve in was six inches in my 135i MT. But its now AWD either.

You did not say how much snow you get/drive in the winter time?

IF you attemp to drive in snow with summers you won't go anywhere! When I picked my car up in Jan, I almost didn't make it up the dealers ever so slight ramp/entrance" onto public roads! lol The next day I picked up my winter set of wheels/tires. I am not a fan of all seasons - too" much of a compromise. Doesn't really work in either snow nor dry. Just MHO.

I think as long as you only drive in a little bit of snow... you will be ok. Or... maybe you should get a winter beater like a Subie AWD for the winter months? Those things never get stuck!

bye
David

emtrey · 04-08-2010, 06:26 AM

SNOW TIRES...probably Blizzaks for alot of deeper snow...Dunlop D3s if lighter snow and better ride/handling are desired. You could go -1 on wheels/tire size to further enhance the winter setup.

JimD · 04-08-2010, 07:17 AM

I haven't driven my 128i in the snow - I have a SUV and the one time it's snowed here since I bought the bimmer I drove that. But my first car was a 1966 mustang. Rear wheel drive and much worse weight distribution. This was in Kansas City which doesn't get the snow of the bad areas of CO but we got the occasional 12 inch snowstorm and had snow every winter (and some ice which is worse). The only time I got stuck in the 4 or 5 years I drove that car was because I was parked next to a fence and I was moving but sliding sideways into the fence. Rather than ruin the paint, I let a friend tow me a bit away from the fence. Otherwise I went everywhere I needed to.

Front wheel drive has a somewhat undeserved reputation IMHO for being better in snow due in large part to the reason our 1s understeer at the limit. For inexperienced relatively low skill drivers, understeer is safer than oversteer. A front wheel drive will understeer when it looses traction and the driver will know. A rear wheel car will oversteer which means you have to be paying at least a tiny bit of a attention to know it is occuring. The only other difference is weight distribution where front wheel drive has a higher percentage on the front wheels. If you think you need more with rear wheel drive, you can always throw a sack of sand in the trunk (I did sometimes in the mustang).

With appropriate tires, rear wheel is fine. I prefer it. I almost wrecked years ago in a little Ford Festiva coming down a steep hill in snow because the engine breaking would make the front wheels slide (this was in Pittsburgh, PA). I figured out I could drag the back end with the emergency brake before I crashed, fortunately. With a rear wheel drive car, there would not have been the challenge to my driving ability.

I've owned one 4WD, a Suzuki SUV. It had a low range I used once (to pull logs up a hill). I drove it one or two times after a 8-12 inch snow on unplowed roads to be sure I could. I didn't really need to. I do not see the point of a 4WD car. You do not have the ground clearance to go in deep snow and for lesser amounts of snow, you do not need 4WD. I drove from 30+ years in snow country and for all but ~5 of those years, it was in 2WD, mostly rear.

Jim

jkp1187 · 04-08-2010, 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sensasia

As my first post, I have to say that I've been an active forum member on several motorcycle/automotive forums but the input and information here far exceeds many of them. Otherwise, I'm currently in the market for a replacement for my Accord and I've only found one other post related to this topic, though, it didn't have exactly the kind of information I was looking for:

Having recently test drove a 2010 128i, I completely fell in love with the feedback of the handling and overall driving experience. My most major concern, however, was realistically driving the vehicle in the snow (I understand that many members have testified to the 1er's ability in the snow but I don't see how a RWD, even with snow tires, can survive some of the snow-storms here in CO). Having said that, I test drove a 2007 328xi. Both the 1er and 328xi were 6MT, black on black, and look great; however, the 328xi really lacked the driving experience of the 1er. In fact, I would go as far as to say that the 328xi was similar to a G37S I drove in that it was almost too comfortable for my taste, even though it is a refined and winter-safe car. I did, however, like how mature the 328xi is as it is a more practical car in the long run.

So, the question is: In your ownership knowledge, is the experience of owning and driving a 128i worth passing up a 328xi, even while the 1er demands more care in the winter?

Thanks and I'd appreciate any information, opinions, or experiences that would help me narrow which to set my sights on.

I got caught out the first night the blizzard hit Pittsburgh in my 135i. Had Blizzak winter tires on. The car was mostly secure (in fact, I left a few FWD cars behind in the dust, that night,) but I *did* have trouble getting up a relatively steep hill. Luckily, there was no traffic around, and I was able to eventually get up the hill. Afterward, it did get stuck on an unplowed road (unfortunately, the only road leading to my house,) and I had to dig it out. Not deal-killers, because the blizzard this year was really bad, but points to consider. I really doubt that my wife's FWD Pontiac Sedan, also equipped with winter tires, would have had problems with either. (I made a point of driving that sedan to work for the rest of the blizzard season, and had no problems with it.)

My thought is: for a RWD sports coupe, it did very well with winter tires. With this past winter under my belt, I'm not sure I'd pull the trigger on it if it were my *only* car (i.e., you don't have a FWD or AWD option,) in a mountainous area that's guaranteed to get lots of snow.

jkp1187 · 04-08-2010, 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimD

Front wheel drive has a somewhat undeserved reputation IMHO for being better in snow due in large part to the reason our 1s understeer at the limit. For inexperienced relatively low skill drivers, understeer is safer than oversteer. A front wheel drive will understeer when it looses traction and the driver will know.

Sorry to hijack the thread a little, but I disagree with this -- from my perspective (living in hilly Pittsburgh,) FWD has a very deserved reputation for being better in the snow, not because of the understeer/oversteer issues because with the weight of the engine over the drive wheels, which gives the car more traction. The only issues I had this winter in the 135i involved traction issues - difficult to get up an icy hill, getting stuck in an unplowed road.

My wife and I took our cars to a local track for a winter driving course in December. They had a relatively steep hill iced up on one side, and made everyone turn the traction control off, go up the hill half way, stop, then try to proceed. The 135i with winter tires (along with a surprising number of AWD vehicles that were also there that day,) failed to get up the hill. Had to back down and go up the clearer side. My wife's FWD Pontiac G6 with snow tires went right up the hill, no problems.

sensasia · 04-08-2010, 11:17 AM

Hm, thanks to everyone for your previous and continuous comments --- there is definitely a lot to think about here and it seems like a lot of people share different experiences. I'm assuming a lot of the 1er's capabilities in the winter are based on driving experience, where to and where from I am driving, and some spot-on snow tires.

Other than the concern with snow, what does everyone think about the overall driving experience? From a 10 year ownership perspective, would you rather opt for a spunky, aggressive, and smaller 128i or a matured, practically balanced, and relaxing-to-the-brink-of-near-boredom-for-someone-in-his-mid-twenties 328xi as a DD?

As a side note: The snowstorms in Denver (CO) are typically pretty unpredictable, although, a good 6 to 15 inches can be expected. I also enjoy skiing so any experiences taking a car up to a resort would also be greatly appreciated.

Thanks again for all the input!

tgxmike · 04-08-2010, 11:42 AM

I live in Albany NY.

I bought my car in January 09 and drove it in many storms that year and it was pretty decent on stock tires. However those stock tire wore quickly and I decided to get snows the following year (dec09/jan10). Best investment ever.

I have a 128i with snow tires (General Altimax) on my stock 256 wheels and I have to say even with a 20'' snow fall the car was incredible. I was easily crusing along at regular speeds without any problem. This car was better than my Hyundai Sonata and Accent I had in the past too. The car is perfectly able in the snow. However you can go through snow deeper than the ride hight of the car. I have not gone skiing with my car, but have driven the Palisades interstate parkway in the snow..... Mountainous concrete road which is never plowed, and the car was fine.

I had my first oil chage in a slighly snow fall. So my loaner was a 328xi, with stock tires. The 3er was solid, but not as good as my car in the snow with snow tires.

Bottom Line: I think both cars with snow tires will provide plenty of traction for your needs. You should def get snow tires and summer tires for which ever car you buy, because the run-craps are terrible. (If you lease the car take the run flats off right away and save them for when you turn the car in.)

Good Luck, hope you join the 1er family.

Also no offense to some of the other comments, but you should not put yourself in some of those hilly situations where you stop.

grish · 04-08-2010, 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sensasia

...I don't see how a RWD, even with snow tires, can survive some of the snow-storms...

Prior to purchasing the 128 I had a Mazda Protege5, FWD 5MT.

The 128 with snow tires handles better then Mazda with all season tires.

My wife's car is a Camry, FWD AT, which is basically a dead ringer for an Accord.

128 handles better with snow tires then Camry with all season tires. Camry with winter tires handles with same ease as 128 with winter tires.

I had my concerns about winter, but was blown away at how good the car was in the snow, with the winter tires though.

JasonCSU · 04-08-2010, 12:40 PM

For the most part, RWD with decent snow tires will get around in the snow just fine. That is until the snow/slush starts to get deep. I'm still glad I drive my WRX during those random storms we get here in CO. Without the slightly added clearance and AWD of the WRX, there are several times I probably would have ended up stuck in a couple of those storms if I were driving a RWD car with less clearance.

jkp1187 makes a good point about traction going up hills as well. If you do like going up skiing a lot, (as do I) I'd recommend picking up another car to use as a winter beater if you can. I'm sure you know that I-70 through the mountains can get covered in snow pretty quick during a storm even with CDOT plows out in force. A FWD or AWD car with snow tires will be much easier to get around in during those times.

stovesax08 · 04-08-2010, 12:41 PM

In my experience driving around CO, if you have proper snow tires you should be find in Denver. The only troubles I've had have been on steep gradient hills (I actually got caught out when it wasn't supposed to be snowing with summer tires on and made it up the 12% grad hill that leads to my house, albeit with some difficulty). As for going up to the mountains you might have some trouble if the roads aren't plowed yet.

cadeucsb · 04-08-2010, 12:59 PM

Not wanting to get stuck on hills, along with all the garbage they put on the roads in the winter here in Denver and the fact that my garage is on an un-plowed alley, I went with an older Jeep as my winter car here in CO. Costs a little more than a winter wheel/tire setup, but not that much more (plus they are easy, fun and cheap to work on).

I enjoy the peace of mind knowing I can go anywhere anytime (especially having kids). This winter was relatively tame (no major march snow) but it was nice having the jeep out while the 1er slept in the garage.

aksundog · 04-08-2010, 01:55 PM

In AK we have six months of snow on the ground and months at a time where you see nothing but ice covered roads and have no idea where the lane lines are anymore. I also live on a hillside that gets closed some days in the winter because people can't make it up and they slide into each other (slipping down backwards).

I put studded Nokian Hakkapeliitta 4's on the 135 and had no issues this winter. The only problem would be clearance issues if you had a big day of snow, aside from that this car handles the snow just as good as my old Accord and my wife's Acura RDX (on all weather tires).

JimD · 04-08-2010, 03:23 PM

jkp 1187,

14 of my 30 plus years of driving in snow country were in Pittsburgh, Pa. My scary experience with a front wheel drive in snow was in Pittsburgh so I am pretty familiar with Pittsburgh driving conditions.

If you like your wife's front wheel drive in the snow then I have no problem with you driving it. If the tires are the same, I am confident the most you would need to do to go anywhere you can in her FWD in your 135 is to make sure you don't high center and maybe add a bag of sand to the trunk.

In other words, if ground clearance is an issue, then I will agree more is better. And FWD does tend to put more weight over the driving wheels which is an advantage. But it is easy to add some more weight on the driving wheels of a RWD car by putting something heavy in the trunk (I recommend sand because if you have an ice storm, the sand can be handy).

You can't fix the disadvantage of a FWD manual transmission car in slippery conditions. It is bad news when engine breaking eliminates both your ability to move the car AND your ability to steer the car. That does not happen with RWD and eliminates for me the weight distribution advantage of FWD (which I can fix when appropriate).

I still say it is closer than most people think. I prefer RWD. But I have no problem with others who prefer FWD. But I would put a bag of sand in the trunk and drive a 135 before I drove a Pontiac.

I also find interesting that the 4WD vehicles in your example seem to have done about as well as your 135i. I bet they were on all season tires.

Jim

jkp1187 · 04-08-2010, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tgxmike

Also no offense to some of the other comments, but you should not put yourself in some of those hilly situations where you stop.

If this was in reference to me, sometimes you do not have a choice about being "in some of those hilly situations where you stop." When you're going to have only ONE car, you need to consider that you may NEED to be out and about when you'd prefer not to be.

jkp1187 · 04-08-2010, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sensasia

Hm, thanks to everyone for your previous and continuous comments --- there is definitely a lot to think about here and it seems like a lot of people share different experiences. I'm assuming a lot of the 1er's capabilities in the winter are based on driving experience, where to and where from I am driving, and some spot-on snow tires.

Other than the concern with snow, what does everyone think about the overall driving experience? From a 10 year ownership perspective, would you rather opt for a spunky, aggressive, and smaller 128i or a matured, practically balanced, and relaxing-to-the-brink-of-near-boredom-for-someone-in-his-mid-twenties 328xi as a DD?

As a side note: The snowstorms in Denver (CO) are typically pretty unpredictable, although, a good 6 to 15 inches can be expected. I also enjoy skiing so any experiences taking a car up to a resort would also be greatly appreciated.

Thanks again for all the input!

I've test-driven the 128i (sport package) and had a 328xi (non-sport) sedan as a loaner once, and all else being equal, I'd take the 128i without question -- the 328xi is a fine vehicle, but it was heavier and a bit more sedate. The 128i with the sport package is fun to toss around.

Long term, you will have fewer maintenance issues with the RWD than the AWD.

Peakrunner · 04-08-2010, 03:44 PM

Living here in Denver I would say that a 1 series with a quality set of snow tires and some weight in the trunk and you'll be more then fine.

In town, the snow storms that would prohibit you from driving the car are far and few between. If you are venturing up to the mountains then I don't care what you drive sometimes the conditions aren't passable.

I think for the 2% of the year that you might not beable to drive I would go with the 1 series for the other 98% of the time.

KathyFG · 04-08-2010, 03:47 PM

128i 6MT hands down- make sure to get the sport package too. I'm moving to Colorado in a few weeks (from Florida, so NO winter driving skills), and I'm just going to follow most folks' advice and get the winter wheels/tires (Tire Rack of course) when the fall rolls around.

As far as the 328i- nah, to me it's not the same driving dynamic as the 1.

See ya out in Colorado.

jkp1187 · 04-08-2010, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimD

jkp 1187,

14 of my 30 plus years of driving in snow country were in Pittsburgh, Pa. My scary experience with a front wheel drive in snow was in Pittsburgh so I am pretty familiar with Pittsburgh driving conditions.

If you like your wife's front wheel drive in the snow then I have no problem with you driving it. If the tires are the same, I am confident the most you would need to do to go anywhere you can in her FWD in your 135 is to make sure you don't high center and maybe add a bag of sand to the trunk.

In other words, if ground clearance is an issue, then I will agree more is better. And FWD does tend to put more weight over the driving wheels which is an advantage. But it is easy to add some more weight on the driving wheels of a RWD car by putting something heavy in the trunk (I recommend sand because if you have an ice storm, the sand can be handy).

You can't fix the disadvantage of a FWD manual transmission car in slippery conditions. It is bad news when engine breaking eliminates both your ability to move the car AND your ability to steer the car. That does not happen with RWD and eliminates for me the weight distribution advantage of FWD (which I can fix when appropriate).

I still say it is closer than most people think. I prefer RWD. But I have no problem with others who prefer FWD. But I would put a bag of sand in the trunk and drive a 135 before I drove a Pontiac.

I also find interesting that the 4WD vehicles in your example seem to have done about as well as your 135i. I bet they were on all season tires.

Jim

Jim, Well, you certainly have more experience driving than I -- only 20 years in Pa., Delaware, and Illinois versus your 30. And I will not dispute what you state here, either. Personally, though, I will say that until I bought the BMW last year, I had driven nothing but FWD cars, and I've *never* run across the disadvantages of FWD in snow that you describe here: "It is bad news when engine breaking eliminates both your ability to move the car AND your ability to steer the car."

And for the record, I have confidence in the 135i to handle most of what goes on during the winter. I'm certainly not complaining -- the 135i got me home safely. Not everyone could say that when the blizzard struck. (Getting stuck was probably more due to the car's clearance than anything.) (Also for the record: had a bag of cat litter in the trunk, too.)

I'll also agree that I much preferred the BMW's handling over the Pontiac's in winter -- the only advantage to the Pontiac was that when some of Pittsburgh's streets remained unplowed a week after the blizzard hit, traction was the issue, and it was just easier to get going in that car than the BMW. I'm thinking that for next winter, I will get some chains in case we get another ridiculous blizzard.

Regarding the Pontiac, I'm not much of a fan of that car and am looking forward to the day it can be traded in, but I have to give it props -- it got up the icy hill at the track when most other cars that day couldn't.

And I think you're dead right about the AWD vehicles having trouble on the hill. All-seasons strike again!

But my point was, ultimately, when you're dealing with massive amounts of snow in the hills, traction is (for me, anyway,) the big issue, and if the OP is just getting *one* car and is not sure if RWD is the way to go, he should weight the issue carefully.

ABQBMW · 04-09-2010, 10:03 PM

One other thing I would add: I live and work in a town in the NM mountains at about 8,000+ feet. We can get a foot and a half of snow in a night. I have had 3+ ft drifts in front of my garage door half a dozen times this year. I have a Jeep Liberty which is awesome in the snow, even on nights when there is a line of cars which can't get up one of the hills.

Even if my 1er could handle the snow (I haven't had it long enough to try), I would not want to subject the car to the salt and other crap they put down on the roads everywhere here. After the first snow hits in October, until about now, the town is a filthy, potholed mess on the roads. The upside is we do have a fair amount of dry sunny days, on which the 128 will be a refreshing change.

Denver doesn't get snow like we do here, and I don't know the salt/pothole factor there, so I would say 128 over 328!

04-08-2010, 12:41 AM	#1
sensasia Registered 3 Rep 3 Posts Drives: 2005 Honda Accord LX-SE Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Denver, CO (USA) iTrader: (0)	First Post: 128i versus 328xi coupe in Colorado As my first post, I have to say that I've been an active forum member on several motorcycle/automotive forums but the input and information here far exceeds many of them. Otherwise, I'm currently in the market for a replacement for my Accord and I've only found one other post related to this topic, though, it didn't have exactly the kind of information I was looking for: Having recently test drove a 2010 128i, I completely fell in love with the feedback of the handling and overall driving experience. My most major concern, however, was realistically driving the vehicle in the snow (I understand that many members have testified to the 1er's ability in the snow but I don't see how a RWD, even with snow tires, can survive some of the snow-storms here in CO). Having said that, I test drove a 2007 328xi. Both the 1er and 328xi were 6MT, black on black, and look great; however, the 328xi really lacked the driving experience of the 1er. In fact, I would go as far as to say that the 328xi was similar to a G37S I drove in that it was almost too comfortable for my taste, even though it is a refined and winter-safe car. I did, however, like how mature the 328xi is as it is a more practical car in the long run. So, the question is: In your ownership knowledge, is the experience of owning and driving a 128i worth passing up a 328xi, even while the 1er demands more care in the winter? Thanks and I'd appreciate any information, opinions, or experiences that would help me narrow which to set my sights on.
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04-08-2010, 04:51 AM	#2
fwmcb Major 31 Rep 1,107 Posts Drives: 2015 F30 328i X-drive Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: NB iTrader: (0) Garage List 2010 128i [0.00]	Honestly, we get quite a bit of snow up here. And my 128i works great in the snow. The only times that rwd isn't enough you probably shouldn't be out.
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04-08-2010, 05:01 AM	#3
Dackelone European Editor 10633 Rep 22,992 Posts Drives: N54 e82 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Bayern, Germany iTrader: (1)	As long as you get an extra set of wheels/snow tires/and TPMS(tire pressure sensors) you will be ok. That is what I did and I never got stuck in the whote stuff. The most snow I had drve in was six inches in my 135i MT. But its now AWD either. You did not say how much snow you get/drive in the winter time? IF you attemp to drive in snow with summers you won't go anywhere! When I picked my car up in Jan, I almost didn't make it up the dealers ever so slight ramp/entrance" onto public roads! lol The next day I picked up my winter set of wheels/tires. I am not a fan of all seasons - too" much of a compromise. Doesn't really work in either snow nor dry. Just MHO. I think as long as you only drive in a little bit of snow... you will be ok. Or... maybe you should get a winter beater like a Subie AWD for the winter months? Those things never get stuck! bye David
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04-08-2010, 06:26 AM	#4
emtrey Captain 92 Rep 857 Posts Drives: 16 M235IX, 06 Carrera S, 335i Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Midwest iTrader: (0)	SNOW TIRES...probably Blizzaks for alot of deeper snow...Dunlop D3s if lighter snow and better ride/handling are desired. You could go -1 on wheels/tire size to further enhance the winter setup. Last edited by emtrey; 04-08-2010 at 06:36 AM..
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04-08-2010, 07:17 AM	#5
JimD Brigadier General 369 Rep 3,547 Posts Drives: 128i convertible Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Lexington, SC iTrader: (0)	I haven't driven my 128i in the snow - I have a SUV and the one time it's snowed here since I bought the bimmer I drove that. But my first car was a 1966 mustang. Rear wheel drive and much worse weight distribution. This was in Kansas City which doesn't get the snow of the bad areas of CO but we got the occasional 12 inch snowstorm and had snow every winter (and some ice which is worse). The only time I got stuck in the 4 or 5 years I drove that car was because I was parked next to a fence and I was moving but sliding sideways into the fence. Rather than ruin the paint, I let a friend tow me a bit away from the fence. Otherwise I went everywhere I needed to. Front wheel drive has a somewhat undeserved reputation IMHO for being better in snow due in large part to the reason our 1s understeer at the limit. For inexperienced relatively low skill drivers, understeer is safer than oversteer. A front wheel drive will understeer when it looses traction and the driver will know. A rear wheel car will oversteer which means you have to be paying at least a tiny bit of a attention to know it is occuring. The only other difference is weight distribution where front wheel drive has a higher percentage on the front wheels. If you think you need more with rear wheel drive, you can always throw a sack of sand in the trunk (I did sometimes in the mustang). With appropriate tires, rear wheel is fine. I prefer it. I almost wrecked years ago in a little Ford Festiva coming down a steep hill in snow because the engine breaking would make the front wheels slide (this was in Pittsburgh, PA). I figured out I could drag the back end with the emergency brake before I crashed, fortunately. With a rear wheel drive car, there would not have been the challenge to my driving ability. I've owned one 4WD, a Suzuki SUV. It had a low range I used once (to pull logs up a hill). I drove it one or two times after a 8-12 inch snow on unplowed roads to be sure I could. I didn't really need to. I do not see the point of a 4WD car. You do not have the ground clearance to go in deep snow and for lesser amounts of snow, you do not need 4WD. I drove from 30+ years in snow country and for all but ~5 of those years, it was in 2WD, mostly rear. Jim __________________ 128i Convertible, MT, Alpine White, Black Top, Taupe Leatherette, Walnut, Sport Ordered 5/22/09, Completed 6/4/09, At Port 6/9/09, On the Georgia Highway 6/13/09, Ship Arrived Charleston 6/24/09 at 10pm, PCD 7/21/09
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04-08-2010, 11:17 AM	#8
sensasia Registered 3 Rep 3 Posts Drives: 2005 Honda Accord LX-SE Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Denver, CO (USA) iTrader: (0)	Hm, thanks to everyone for your previous and continuous comments --- there is definitely a lot to think about here and it seems like a lot of people share different experiences. I'm assuming a lot of the 1er's capabilities in the winter are based on driving experience, where to and where from I am driving, and some spot-on snow tires. Other than the concern with snow, what does everyone think about the overall driving experience? From a 10 year ownership perspective, would you rather opt for a spunky, aggressive, and smaller 128i or a matured, practically balanced, and relaxing-to-the-brink-of-near-boredom-for-someone-in-his-mid-twenties 328xi as a DD? As a side note: The snowstorms in Denver (CO) are typically pretty unpredictable, although, a good 6 to 15 inches can be expected. I also enjoy skiing so any experiences taking a car up to a resort would also be greatly appreciated. Thanks again for all the input!
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04-08-2010, 11:42 AM	#9
tgxmike Second Lieutenant 18 Rep 293 Posts Drives: '21 M2C 6MT, '21 Charger Scat Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Boise, ID iTrader: (0) Garage List 2021 BMW M2 [0.00]	I live in Albany NY. I bought my car in January 09 and drove it in many storms that year and it was pretty decent on stock tires. However those stock tire wore quickly and I decided to get snows the following year (dec09/jan10). Best investment ever. I have a 128i with snow tires (General Altimax) on my stock 256 wheels and I have to say even with a 20'' snow fall the car was incredible. I was easily crusing along at regular speeds without any problem. This car was better than my Hyundai Sonata and Accent I had in the past too. The car is perfectly able in the snow. However you can go through snow deeper than the ride hight of the car. I have not gone skiing with my car, but have driven the Palisades interstate parkway in the snow..... Mountainous concrete road which is never plowed, and the car was fine. I had my first oil chage in a slighly snow fall. So my loaner was a 328xi, with stock tires. The 3er was solid, but not as good as my car in the snow with snow tires. Bottom Line: I think both cars with snow tires will provide plenty of traction for your needs. You should def get snow tires and summer tires for which ever car you buy, because the run-craps are terrible. (If you lease the car take the run flats off right away and save them for when you turn the car in.) Good Luck, hope you join the 1er family. Also no offense to some of the other comments, but you should not put yourself in some of those hilly situations where you stop. Last edited by tgxmike; 04-08-2010 at 11:45 AM.. Reason: additions
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04-08-2010, 12:40 PM	#11
JasonCSU Colonel 702 Rep 2,548 Posts Drives: '08 135i, '88 325is Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Denver, CO iTrader: (0) Garage List 1988 BMW 325is [0.00] 2008 BMW 135i [0.00]	For the most part, RWD with decent snow tires will get around in the snow just fine. That is until the snow/slush starts to get deep. I'm still glad I drive my WRX during those random storms we get here in CO. Without the slightly added clearance and AWD of the WRX, there are several times I probably would have ended up stuck in a couple of those storms if I were driving a RWD car with less clearance. jkp1187 makes a good point about traction going up hills as well. If you do like going up skiing a lot, (as do I) I'd recommend picking up another car to use as a winter beater if you can. I'm sure you know that I-70 through the mountains can get covered in snow pretty quick during a storm even with CDOT plows out in force. A FWD or AWD car with snow tires will be much easier to get around in during those times. __________________ Delivered in Munich, broken in on the Nurburgring.
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04-08-2010, 12:41 PM	#12
stovesax08 Second Lieutenant 7 Rep 269 Posts Drives: 135i, X5 45e Join Date: Feb 2008 iTrader: (0)	In my experience driving around CO, if you have proper snow tires you should be find in Denver. The only troubles I've had have been on steep gradient hills (I actually got caught out when it wasn't supposed to be snowing with summer tires on and made it up the 12% grad hill that leads to my house, albeit with some difficulty). As for going up to the mountains you might have some trouble if the roads aren't plowed yet. __________________ 135i Coupe-Manual, Montego, Lemon, HG Black, sport, premium, CA, HiFi, Ipod/USB, heated seats
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04-08-2010, 12:59 PM	#13
cadeucsb Captain 34 Rep 604 Posts Drives: TiAg 135i Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: here iTrader: (3)	Not wanting to get stuck on hills, along with all the garbage they put on the roads in the winter here in Denver and the fact that my garage is on an un-plowed alley, I went with an older Jeep as my winter car here in CO. Costs a little more than a winter wheel/tire setup, but not that much more (plus they are easy, fun and cheap to work on). I enjoy the peace of mind knowing I can go anywhere anytime (especially having kids). This winter was relatively tame (no major march snow) but it was nice having the jeep out while the 1er slept in the garage.
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04-08-2010, 01:55 PM	#14
aksundog Private First Class 13 Rep 107 Posts Drives: 135i Join Date: May 2009 Location: Anchorage, AK iTrader: (1)	In AK we have six months of snow on the ground and months at a time where you see nothing but ice covered roads and have no idea where the lane lines are anymore. I also live on a hillside that gets closed some days in the winter because people can't make it up and they slide into each other (slipping down backwards). I put studded Nokian Hakkapeliitta 4's on the 135 and had no issues this winter. The only problem would be clearance issues if you had a big day of snow, aside from that this car handles the snow just as good as my old Accord and my wife's Acura RDX (on all weather tires).
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04-08-2010, 03:23 PM	#15
JimD Brigadier General 369 Rep 3,547 Posts Drives: 128i convertible Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Lexington, SC iTrader: (0)	jkp 1187, 14 of my 30 plus years of driving in snow country were in Pittsburgh, Pa. My scary experience with a front wheel drive in snow was in Pittsburgh so I am pretty familiar with Pittsburgh driving conditions. If you like your wife's front wheel drive in the snow then I have no problem with you driving it. If the tires are the same, I am confident the most you would need to do to go anywhere you can in her FWD in your 135 is to make sure you don't high center and maybe add a bag of sand to the trunk. In other words, if ground clearance is an issue, then I will agree more is better. And FWD does tend to put more weight over the driving wheels which is an advantage. But it is easy to add some more weight on the driving wheels of a RWD car by putting something heavy in the trunk (I recommend sand because if you have an ice storm, the sand can be handy). You can't fix the disadvantage of a FWD manual transmission car in slippery conditions. It is bad news when engine breaking eliminates both your ability to move the car AND your ability to steer the car. That does not happen with RWD and eliminates for me the weight distribution advantage of FWD (which I can fix when appropriate). I still say it is closer than most people think. I prefer RWD. But I have no problem with others who prefer FWD. But I would put a bag of sand in the trunk and drive a 135 before I drove a Pontiac. I also find interesting that the 4WD vehicles in your example seem to have done about as well as your 135i. I bet they were on all season tires. Jim __________________ 128i Convertible, MT, Alpine White, Black Top, Taupe Leatherette, Walnut, Sport Ordered 5/22/09, Completed 6/4/09, At Port 6/9/09, On the Georgia Highway 6/13/09, Ship Arrived Charleston 6/24/09 at 10pm, PCD 7/21/09
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04-08-2010, 03:44 PM	#18
Peakrunner Mile High Member 6 Rep 109 Posts Drives: 2012 x5d Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Renton, WA iTrader: (0)	Living here in Denver I would say that a 1 series with a quality set of snow tires and some weight in the trunk and you'll be more then fine. In town, the snow storms that would prohibit you from driving the car are far and few between. If you are venturing up to the mountains then I don't care what you drive sometimes the conditions aren't passable. I think for the 2% of the year that you might not beable to drive I would go with the 1 series for the other 98% of the time. __________________ I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to you all day long and assume you deserve it Last edited by Peakrunner; 04-08-2010 at 03:55 PM..
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04-08-2010, 03:47 PM	#19
KathyFG Private First Class 6 Rep 133 Posts Drives: 2009 AW 128i coupe 6MT Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Aurora, CO iTrader: (0)	128i 6MT hands down- make sure to get the sport package too. I'm moving to Colorado in a few weeks (from Florida, so NO winter driving skills), and I'm just going to follow most folks' advice and get the winter wheels/tires (Tire Rack of course) when the fall rolls around. As far as the 328i- nah, to me it's not the same driving dynamic as the 1. See ya out in Colorado.
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04-09-2010, 10:03 PM	#21
ABQBMW Enlisted Member 0 Rep 34 Posts Drives: 2008 128i: Blue Water Baby! Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: NM iTrader: (0)	One other thing I would add: I live and work in a town in the NM mountains at about 8,000+ feet. We can get a foot and a half of snow in a night. I have had 3+ ft drifts in front of my garage door half a dozen times this year. I have a Jeep Liberty which is awesome in the snow, even on nights when there is a line of cars which can't get up one of the hills. Even if my 1er could handle the snow (I haven't had it long enough to try), I would not want to subject the car to the salt and other crap they put down on the roads everywhere here. After the first snow hits in October, until about now, the town is a filthy, potholed mess on the roads. The upside is we do have a fair amount of dry sunny days, on which the 128 will be a refreshing change. Denver doesn't get snow like we do here, and I don't know the salt/pothole factor there, so I would say 128 over 328!
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